Sunday Times 4765 by David McLean – enjoy what you do

36 comments on “Sunday Times 4765 by David McLean – enjoy what you do”

1. At least that’s what the club says, and I may well have done this online to the bitter end; I can’t remember. I raised an eyebrow (one of mine, so it’s OK) with ‘steel’, too; I suppose they’re interchangeable metaphorically (man of iron/steel) if not metallurgically, but still. DNK the cocktail, and don’t want to know. Also DNK THROW A WOBBLER, which may have been my LOI. I failed to parse 26ac and 19d, so thanks K. COD to 25ac.
2. Actually, 4d caused more than intimations with a birthday looming. I’ve already reached the ‘he had a decent innings’ stage for the eulogy. I guess it’s another decade before it becomes ‘a good innings’ and two more before ‘long’. Unfortunately ‘carrying one’s bat’ doesn’t seem to be possible. I mention this in connection with the vulgarity/ morality question raised by Keriothe, with my values certainly shaped by the scrag end of the Victorian Christian revival still with us after the second world war. I didn’t like 23d. I laughed and made COD to 8d, possibly because in my innocence I’d never labelled suburban lavatory visits and cocaine-taking with the same euphemism. So it’s the offensive language I didn’t care for. I could turn all modern and say that using the female body as an insult is the problem, a view I do share, but I’d not have liked it without that. I swear liberally, include all the swear words I know in my writings, but I don’t like it in the Crossword. There’s no logic to this, but then aren’t all morals are matters of taste? 58 minutes on an otherwise excellent puzzle. Thank you K and David.
3. Hmm, The Times website tells me I scored 500 for this crossword, a record of sorts .. apparently ddemitase is not a proper word. Since I had a typo on the Saturday cryptic as well, a dismal weekend all in all..

   I tend not to be bothered at all by swearwords or nooky-related words, (nooky, I see as a safe euphemism for use when aged aunts are in the room .. so rather surprised to find others objected to it, maybe its a UK/US difference) but I do dislike drug cant. My objection is mainly around my apparently being expected to know familiar slang terms for highly illegal activities. I’m not sure how much logic there is in this, I knew jug and slammer without actually being a jailbird. But it works for me.

4. From memory, I think I did quite well with this one, being more familiar with swear words than, say, the names of 18th century Italian physicists. Although I do remember forgetting, appropriately enough, to enter 3dn, thereby ruling myself out of the weekly prize draw.

   However, there is good news too. Since the Club relaunch I have been unable to access the puzzles on the site with my laptop. I have instead struggled on gamely with my mini iPad, which has had no trouble accessing the puzzles but has had plenty of trouble accepting the letters of an entry in the order in which they were typed. Yesterday, my laptop underwent a massive Windows 10 upgrade which required numerous restarts. Today, miracle of miracles, I found I was able to access all areas of the site including the puzzles, exclamation mark. I celebrated by biffing correctly the entire ST Concise puzzle in, for me, a record time. Deep joy. It made me wonder if the access problems a few of us have been enduring has resulted from the staggered release of the Windows 10 upgrade. I have alerted the Times staff accordingly.

5. Just over an hour for this one. Held up by 26ac where although familiar with the expression “many moons ago”, I wasn’t sure “moon” meant “month” as opposed to just many nights ago, appearing as it does in the night sky every night. Also hesitant to put in “throw a wobbler” because the expression I am more familiar with is “throw a wobbly”. 9ac bunged in from whiskey and checkers without seeing the parsing, so thank you for that. I liked 10ac but COD to 8dn which had me baffled for some time before I saw the light. For me, from memory, the last two David McLean puzzles have been absolutely outstanding so although good, this puzzle wasn’t quite up to that standard and so felt a little flat. I was unoffended by the tit, the Charlie, the wobbler or the snot-level of the review but then I am a very common, vulgar sort of fellow. Thought anon above could have made whatever point they wanted to make without being so deliberately rude. I can see no need for it.
6. No problems here with any of the stuff that’s apparently giving others cause for concern on the moral front except if the idea at 1dn is that “wobbly” = “chubby person” I can’t find it in any of the usual sources, even extended to the on-line versions.

   Chubby Checker was famous for the Twist so the obvious answer for me was “Throws a twister”, which sounds perfectly possible as an expression meaning “goes mad” with reference to the destructive power tornadoes. On checking whether it might do so, I looked up ‘twister’ and in the process expanded my knowledge of drug culture still further, which may come in handy in for future puzzles: An intravenous injection of a narcotic drug, esp. a combined dose of heroin or morphine and cocaine.

   Edited at 2017-10-01 08:15 am (UTC)

7. I think this is one of the snottiest reviews I’ve had the displeasure of reading on here.

   I took Chubby Checker to be a “wobbler” as a reference to doing the twist – if you can do it without wobbling, good luck to you. And anyway if Mr Checker is happy to be known as Chubby, which presumably he is, why should you take offence where none exists?

   As for the drug related clue (which has a brilliant surface don’t you think?) if you consider the setter, by merely mentioning it is condoning illegal activity, fine. I don’t. Presumably you wouldn’t wish to see “fence” used other than as the boundary of a property, etc. etc.

   You claim “I know for a fact that some of our regular contributors object – not without reason – to drug-related language appearing in these puzzles”. Fine, let them say so themselves. And “I enjoy the sometimes slightly more risqué flavour of the these puzzles.”

   I don’t believe you. If that’s what you really thought you wouldn’t discuss it at length. I detest people trying to justify their own opinions on the basis that they are talking on behalf of others rather than themselves. Are you a politician?

   To be fair I’ve seen better ST puzzles than this – I don’t take much notice of who’s set them, but my impression is that this wasn’t quite as good as some of Mr McLean’s previous efforts.

   ST puzzles tend to reflect contemporary life; surely that’s much more relevant than the Greek mythology, obscure Latin phrases, or even unheard of plants and trees from remote parts of the world that still appear from time to time in the weekday puzzles.

   1. I saw nothing snotty in Keriothe’s blog. I think it was legitimate for him to raise the issue, as it is for you to present a robust view in favour of compilers presenting today’s reality. A personal attack though, on this pleasant forum for both understanding and camaraderie, is unwarranted.
   2. Crikey someone got out of bed on the wrong side this morning.
      1. Assuming he sleeps in a bed.
   3. An interesting contribution which might carry a little more weight if it was not posted completely anonymously.
      1. Refer to me as Pat if you wish. That’s not quite so anonymous. But there’s no option to change that above.

         Jackkt, boltonwanderer et al, are no less anonymous are they?

         I’m glad I wasn’t the only to realise that keriothe’s opening wince about wobbler was completely wide of the mark.

         1. There’s no problem about posting here with an anonymous account (although it’s completely free to open one if you wish) but it’s considered a bit antisocial to comment without adding a name or nickname somewhere in the message, and expecially so if one is being controversial, or dare I say it, actually rude, which is frowned upon anyway in this usually very friendly place.

            Live Journal user-names such as mine and boltonwanderer are chosen, registered identities and as such we are accountable for our behaviour and comments both to LJ and the hosts of TftT.

            Edited at 2017-10-01 12:43 pm (UTC)

   4. I really don’t think there is a place for words like ‘detest’ in TftT. Sadly, intemperate vitriol written from behind the anonymity of a computer screen is more and more prevalent. It even extends beyond that to actual threats uttered at people.
      I think ‘Pat’ should become more temperate or take his or her temper elsewhere.
      On a site which exists to discuss the harmless world of crosswords, there really is no place for such vituperation.
      BTW, I share the expressed unease at being expected to know arcane drug language.

      Edited at 2017-10-01 12:54 pm (UTC)

   5. Easy, chief, it’s only a crossword! 🙂
   6. TIT
   7. Your opinions might carry a little more weight if you hadn’t chosen to remain anonymous. Why would we care about what you think, if you can’t even be bothered to give a name?
      “Snotty” seems as good a description as any of your own words ..
8. Once again, the mists of time prevent me from making a truly representative rendering of my thoughts about this puzzle, but I think it was more amusement than shock/horror. I did however manage to complete it correctly in 43:52, so not too bad an effort. I too spent time trying to associate 1d with The Twist rather than a wobbler. I suppose I had a slightly raised eyebrow along with the giggle at 8d and shrugged as I tried to equate steel with iron. I was slightly surprised to see trade names creeping in, but there again, it is a Sunday puzzle. I think I enjoyed it on the whole. Thanks David and K.
9. Like Jack and others, I thought the Chubby Checker reference was to doing the twist – I reasoned that if it wasn’t, ‘Checker’ would not have been needed and probably wouldn’t have been part of the clue. Like Jack, I bifd Twister in, and like special_bitter got to Wobbley next. I wasn’t offended by At It, but I was surprised earlier in the week by Nooky. I think that might be a regional thing. In the US Nooky is as a particularly vulgar term for female genitals.

   Mrkgrnao’s mention of finally getting access to the Club site (a Pyrrhic victory, no?) got me to thinking that the new software has now had a couple months to settle in. There are still quite a few bugs and nuisances. Some probably are never going to be re-done the way we would like them (I’m thinking of using both the tab and the return keys to move clues along), but some might be fixable (I’m thinking that if the Pro site can remember a user’s settings such as yes or no to putting demarcations into the grid, the Non-Pro site really should be able to as well). Since we are the heavy users, is there any way we can create an edited list that might help the software engineers next time they work on the site?

   Finally, nice blog, Keriothe. Part of the point of the blog is to have some personality, isn’t it? If what you want is answers without opinion and views, this probably isn’t the place to come. And, nice puzzle too.

10. I certainly didn’t intend snottiness. I was really just trying to provoke a conversation. It gets a bit quiet around here on Sundays.

    Edited at 2017-10-01 10:23 am (UTC)

    1. The only snottiness I have ever seen in 10 years of reading this blog is Pat’s.
11. I don’t buy this equivalence beween the twist and wobbling, but a bit of googling turns up a Chubby Checker song called The Hucklebuck which includes the line ‘wiggle like a stick wobble like a duck’ so perhaps that’s what Harry intended.
12. I have “hours and hours” scrawled on my bit of paper, and quite a few question marks, so thanks for the parsings. I was disappointed to find that there doesn’t seem to be anything clever that I missed about the WOBBLER bit of 1d—I don’t personally see how doing the twist would have much to do with it; I think Keriothe’s interpretation seems likely, which would make it not a very good clue.

    I was similarly nonplussed by iron being clued as steel.

    Clues I apparently enjoyed were 3d OOPS and the bafflingly-well-to-me-anyway hidden at 1a. Took me a good few crossers before I spotted TAILORING, at which point I’d have kicked myself if I’d had any energy left.

    Have things just been a lot harder this last week, or is it just me? I still have today’s and yesterday’s puzzles sitting here with a few blanks to fill in, and I did quite badly on the weekdays, too…

13. Thank you, it is. I have two answers left and the last few have been like pulling teeth!

    Edited at 2017-10-01 01:44 pm (UTC)

    1. There were quite a few that took me absolutely ages and then seemed completely obvious once I’d solved them. This makes me think it was one of those ‘wavelength’ puzzles where there is huge variety in solving times. We’ll find out next week. Hopefully Pat will join us to make some more friendly and constructive comments.
14. If it’s any comfort I found today’s extremely difficult!
15. A fun puzzle and I managed to solve most of it eventually.
    Could not get Innings or Pinot Grigio. David
16. Naturally, as one of the least PC people round here – I hope – I wouldn’t be too bothered by a large person related clue. It is a fact of life, especially in certain countries…

    However, I was absolutely appalled by the unheard of throw a wobbler, instead of wobbly, and intend to terminate my subscription to the Times forthwith, hop on a plane to Blighty (which I’m doing anyway later this week) and meet up with Pat for a few bevvies and a discussion of detestables, Keriothe’s speedy solving Times chief amongst them.

17. No idea where; must have been a typo. Great stuff, especially minor injury cover and throne room. Most offensive thing by a long way was 11ac, whose Christmas song is played by my local supermarket seemingly nonstop, all December, every year
18. For me nothing crossed the bounds of good taste, but that may be because I still don’t get 1dn! The singer I know, the wordplay not.
    1. In the wordplay Chubby Checker is a WOBBLER, and therefore to chuck him is to THROW A WOBBLER. This much is clear. The contentious point is why Chubby Checker is a WOBBLER. My initial reading of this was that it is a whimsical assumption that someone with the nickname ‘Chubby’ would be fat, and hence a WOBBLER. Others think that this is a reference to ‘The Twist’: if you’re doing that particular dance then you would be wobbling. There is another Chubby Checker song which refers specifically to wobbling, so this may also be the reference.
       None of these explanations is entirely satisfactory so I’m not sure what the setter intended.
19. I managed this in 19 and change but spoilt it by typing “mirkiness” in at 16D which irked me quite a bit. The more iffy meaning of nose-powdering (and Charlie) in 8D flew completely over my head or under my radar at the time and I’d since forgotten the clue.

    Speaking of irksomeness and noses, our semi-anonymous contributor is rather reminiscent of someone who used to pop up on the Club Forum who had called himself Antwerp – with the inevitable responses from those up whose noses he got.

20. Either I am getting much better (with the help of this blog) or the clues are getting easier.
    Under 60 minutes all week with fewer biff’s and a lot less “oh I see” moments reading the blog.
    Out of sequence with yous (pronounced ewes)(accept it, Australians have invented a perfectly useful pluralisation of you) as I get mine from Mr Murdoch’s digital OZ.

    Agree with the sentiments of anonymous Pat entirely but…chill man! It’s a crossword we do for fun! nobody dies at the end.

    Graham Williams, Melbourne Australia

    1. I rather like this usage. It’s also reasonably common in the US, of course (where they also have y’all) and I have come Scottish people who use it.
       I’m disappointed you agree with Pat. I really didn’t intend to be snarky.
21. I am aged 78 but do not think political correctness should be allowed to interfere with our enjoyment of word play. Moderation in all things should apply, thus occasional boundary pushing should not be pounced on!
22. This one took me about 2 hours! DNK Wham! Did not like ‘UR’ for “your” but maybe I’m old fashioned. Had “wobbley” not wobbler. I think wobbley is more of an OZ expression. Just as a matter of interest a wobbler is also a term used in fly fishing, it is a lure which twists in the water.

Comments are closed.