Hello everyone. If you finished this you did better than me: Wurm wriggled away from your hapless blogger. I had 5 minutes something on the clock with two to go, but then ground to a halt. I let the timer tick on to 10 minutes then stopped it and took a break. Normally this would help, but my mental block persisted so I gave in to a dictionary search. It turns out I had been defeated by a couple of twisty cryptic definitions: 2d was obvious the moment I saw the right answer, while 6d needed more thought. Dawned on my eventually. Self-kick duly administered. The French comic wasn’t the only cunning definition here: there is also 17a’s “Banana Bunch” and “measure up” at 17d. Very nice if you can get them. Thanks Wurm – but I’ll be more of an early bird next time and catch you then!
Definitions are underlined in the clues below. In the explanations, quoted indicators are in italics, specified [deletions] are in square brackets, and I’ve capitalised and emboldened letters which appear in the ANSWER. For clarity, I omit most link words and some juxtaposition indicators.
| Across | |
| 7a | Wimbledon champion we notice inside (4) |
| WADE — WE; AD (notice) inside | |
| 8a | Heavenly tale wrong about this place (8) |
| ETHEREAL — TALE anagrammed (wrong) around (about) HERE (this place) | |
| 9a | Herculean task for governing party (6) |
| LABOUR — Two definitions | |
| 10a | Adept corrected welcomes new stickler (6) |
| PEDANT — An anagram of (… corrected) ADEPT takes in (welcomes) N (new) | |
| 11a | Connection with 007? (4) |
| BOND — Two definitions | |
| 12a | Prudish woman making bloomer (8) |
| PRIMROSE — PRIM (prudish) + ROSE (woman) | |
| 15a | Tyrant Richard Murphy reported? (8) |
| DICTATOR — Sounds like (… reported) DICK (Richard) TATER (murphy, spud) | |
| 17a | Hour with Banana Bunch? (4) |
| HAND — H (hour) + AND (with) | |
| 18a | English in British state work hard (6) |
| BEAVER — E (English) in B (British) plus AVER (state) | |
| 21a | Artist Damien on time to show desire (6) |
| THIRST — HIRST (artist Damien) next to (on) T (time) | |
| 22a | None left? Well! (3,5) |
| ALL RIGHT — If none left, then presumably ALL RIGHT | |
| 23a | On radio man would listen (4) |
| HEED — Sounds like (on radio) HE’D (man would) | |
| Down | |
| 1d | Dandy in a vehicle on entering M1 (8) |
| MACARONI — A, CAR (vehicle) and ON going into (entering) MI [Joker 2365: An 18th-century dandy] | |
| 2d | Get the next round in? (6) |
| RELOAD — A cryptic definition where it’s a round of ammo we are looking for. A round of shots perhaps | |
| 3d | Pride etc terribly battered (8) |
| DECREPIT — An anagram of (… terribly) PRIDE ETC | |
| 4d | Fellow hot wearing beret (4) |
| CHAP — H (hot) in (wearing) CAP (beret) | |
| 5d | Ship on move suddenly reversed (6) |
| TRADER — RE (on) and DART (move suddenly) all reversed | |
| 6d | A French comic entertainer? (4) |
| DAWN — A cryptic definition: DAWN French | |
| 13d | Annoy one rattier drunk (8) |
| IRRITATE — I (one) + RATTIER anagrammed (drunk) | |
| 14d | Menacing relative outside home (8) |
| SINISTER — SISTER (relative) outside IN (home) | |
| 16d | Faulty TV near bar (6) |
| TAVERN — An anagram of (faulty) TV NEAR | |
| 17d | Henley’s first crew measure up? (6) |
| HEIGHT — Henley’s first letter + EIGHT (crew) | |
| 19d | Two lines penned by each girl (4) |
| ELLA — L L (two lines) inside (penned by) EA (each) | |
| 20d | Fix a Latvian city (4) |
| RIGA — RIG (fix) + A | |
Similar experience here with the same two at the end, although on a different timescale
Had just 4 left At 14 minutes. Hand then gave us height leaving just 2d and 6d. After another 14 minutes we had found reload from an extensive alpha trawl but gave up on Dawn – too tricky for us, but a little satisfaction from suffering the same plight as Kitty.
Thanks Wurm.
DNF here too. After 10 minutes I was missing 2dn, 5dn and 6dn. After another 5 minutes I had come up with TRADER, and gave up, so I had the same unsolved as you, Kitty. I agree RELOAD should have been obvious, but then why did two experienced solvers have trouble thinking of it?
Whether intentional by the setter or not, it was the ‘A’ that did for me at 6dn and prevented me thinking of Dawn French. One could argue that it was redundant, but it may have been placed to improve the surface or as a booby-trap to make solving more difficult.
I enjoyed DICTATOR.
I had a virtually identical experience. However at 19 mins and after a full alphabet trawl I bunged in an unparsed DAWN at 6dn with 0 hope it was correct, imagine my surprise…
Reload.
Unlike the USA, not that many people in this country use guns or rifles regularly. So, reload in that sense
does not seem so obvious.
It may surprise those in the UK but the percentage of US population who own a gun is only 30%. Quite a lot more than almost every other country I’m sure, but as a US citizen, I wouldn’t get RELOAD. I entered “second” without really trying to parse it. My other unknown was WADE.
I really don’t mean to advocate for US gun culture or anything, just saying that there are fairly large parts of the population that never think about guns at all, except with a slight sense of wearied tediousness.
The same two did for me too! So simple when you think about it – which obviously I didn’t. Interesting that we had MACARONI in a clue in the 15×15 today. HEIGHT was very clever. COD to RELOAD.
Thanks kitty and setter
Make that at least four experienced solvers who DNF.
The problem I think with 2d & 6d is that they are cryptic definitions only. For a Quick Cryptic – which is supposedly aimed at the less experienced – I would have expected a definition as well, e.g. “Sunup for a French comic entertainer?”.
Also, it’s taking me time to adapt to the new convention on including living persons (three today)
I get the impression that Wurm has embraced the relaxation of the “no living persons” rule more enthusiastically than other setters. I don’t think the crosswords are better for it.
I’ve just made a note to myself to take into account Wurm’s enjoyment of the living persons rule when solving his puzzles in the future. Not sure it would’ve helped today though.
I agree, Kurihan. It doesn’t improve the qc, to include living persons.
Quite so, and in a QC friendly way a ‘proper’ grid would have given us the first and third letters, making the answer more apparent I suspect.
Add me to the those who were completely stumped by the comedian. I eventually gave up as the clock ticked round to 10 minutes. I agree with Jacckt the ‘a’ in the clue made it much more difficult than simply clueing it as ‘French comedian’.
Other than that it was a mainly straightforward solve but with RELOAD and TRADER proving tough towards the end.
Thanks to Kitty.
😉
Hate to be boring, but this was a DNF for me too and no prizes for guessing which two were my undoing. Probably should have got RELOAD but was nowhere near the Vicar. Dead or alive it would have made no difference. Thanks Wurm and Kitty.
Another DNF here but with only DAWN beating me and I agree the ‘A’ didn’t help.
Smiley faces against HAND and HEIGHT.
I was doing so well, I thought, then came to a screeching halt. I was totally lulled into a false sense of my own competence, then Wurm exposed me as the (still) inexperienced solver that I am.
Pi 😞
Ditto!
Gave up with Dawn missing too
Hate not finishing but it’s always satisfying when I have the same problems as experienced solvers. Did eventually get RELOAD and TRADER but could not see DAWN. My excuse – still getting my head round having names of living people.
DNF. Would never have got DAWN, and desperately biffed “second” for RELOAD. Basically it didn’t suit me. Chacun a son gout I suppose.
Yes, TRADER, RELOAD and DAWN at the end. Pleased to have made it all green in 15.51. Enjoyed BEAVER and PRIMROSE but generally satisfaction was down on usual.
Another DNF. I eventually came up with and unparsed Goldie HAWN as the comedienne after 4 minutes of trawling the alphabet. TRADER took a while as I didn’t know that meaning. I enjoyed the rest, though. Thank-you Kitty and Wurm.
10:58, with DAWN LOI. Assumed at first that “A French” would be UN, but no entertainers that I knew fitted *AUN. Trawled the alphabet for alternative letters, wondered briefly if PAIN was the answer, finally got to *AWN before DAWN appeared.
Thanks Kitty and Wurm
DNF
I did think of DAWN as a word that would fit and also the correct sense of “round” but didn’t persevere. Shoulda.
No complaints – the French thing was v good and I’m in the camp that likes the new rule about living folks
Thanks Kitty and Wurm
DNF; DAWN did for me too. Six minutes for the rest. I had no trouble with RELOAD, though since I started with the acrosses I had all the checkers, and it was COD for me.
I am not enjoying the living person thing. Many thanks Wurm and Kitty.
DAWN never dawned on me either.
Didn’t DAWN on me either, and not a QC level clue IMHO, particularly with the A at the start. Why is the A there at all? Are there more comedians called French we might otherwise have considered? It doesn’t seem to form any part of the clue to the actual answer.
As Deezzaa suggests, it could have been a good DD. With the A, and the living person thing being new, and so many *A*N words making an alphabet trawl unappealing, this was, I felt, over obscure.
RELOAD, on the other hand, was a clever clue, because I did get it. Slight MER at TRADER, but it seemed likely.
Super-quick for all but DAWN, which took nearly as long as the rest of the puzzle to dredge up. A similar clue for RELOAD stumped me not so long ago, so nice to know I do occasionally learn.
I like the inclusion of living people. Today’s 15×15 referred to someone I’d never heard of who died five years before I was born, so if that’s fair game…
For any reference to a person, living or dead, I think the important part is that they’re either a) sufficiently well-known (as I think Dawn French is, although it’s a tough clue), b) very clearly clued (as in today’s 15×15), or c) part of the wordplay rather than a solution (as Unai EMERY was recently).
I got RELOAD OK but it took me three rounds of alphabet trawling to remember Dawn French. So finished at 12:20, came close to giving up.
DNF, inevitably on DAWN. Looking at the extraordinary list of people failing on this clue – I would suggest that it is quite unprecedented for so many experienced solvers to fail on the same clue in a QC – I have little hesitation in nominating it as the Worst QC Clue Ever.
It does not increase my enthusiasm for the new rule allowing living people, or Wurm’s particular style of using of it (other setters do seem to be a bit more circumspect).
Oh, the rest of the puzzle. 11 minutes till then, all got but not much enjoyed, several instances of the classic setter’s curse of being too clever by half. A shame, as there were also some very nice clues, and even a few gimme ones among them which got me off to a good start.
Many thanks Kitty for the blog. The week will improve from here …
Cedric
DNF.
I was going o.k. , if a liittle slowly until, I tried 6 down :
“6d A French comic entertainer? (4)
DAWN — A cryptic definition: DAWN French “.
I could not think of a feasible answer after 20 minutes and gave up.
You may disagree, but I think this clue is too hard for a “Quick Cryptic”.
It has ruined the start to my week.
Same as above, save a couple of notable exceptions. 6 minutes to DAWN, then some fruitless staring. Didn’t even get it when I looked it up, and needed Kitty’s help to see it, thanks Kitty.
RELOAD very neat I thought.
Well done Wurm! These living people are an extra weapon in the setter’s armoury.
DNF
DNF, DAWN. Which paired nicely with TRADER as in the CS Lewis book. Coincidence? Guess so. Got RELOAD. Also failed with HAND, which I still don’t understand. I went with HANK (= bunch). And got close with he’d, but went with he’ll.
Dawn Treader rather than Trader, no?
As per the blog, as a hand is what a branch of bananas is called., so a hand of bananas.
I too wondered about “The Voyage of the DT”, my favourite of the Narnia books (and I do know it’s “Treader”, but still wondered) when reading Kitty’s excellent blog and got quite excited when noticing BEAVER as I looked over the grid again.
Came to naught, obviously, but nice to know I wasn’t alone.
A bunch of bananas, while growing, is called a hand.
DNF, Dawn. Good clue, too good for me too.
At first I thought I was never going to get ANYWHERE but suddenly they started to come down south, and then suddenly Reload and Trader came as L2I, but Dawn never made it.
I am happy with people alive or dead as long as they don’t play footie like Unai : -)
Now awaiting Ten Hag’s appearance in the QC. Easy to clue… That’ll ruffle a few feathers.
Got DAWN after remembering new rule, but failed on RELOAD.
Thanks kitty and wurm
One answer never dawned on me…… The problem with living people is that they are often famous in their own time and place. I suspect our antipodean and US cousins would struggle with Wade and French (please correct me if wrong). On the other hand Height was a superb clue, elevating our time wasting to an artform. Thanks Kitty for the blog and Wurm for putting me in my place.
Add me to the DAWN list, but otherwise very enjoyable. I liked RELOAD when I eventually stopped thinking about drinks.
Like many others I was pretty quick at about five minutes with just 2dn and 6dn to do. After what seemed an eternity RELOAD came to me, leaving me with DAWN to solve, and after another hefty chunk of time it finally DAWNed on me. The clock had finally stopped at 18.15, and I was pleasing pretty pleased with myself that I persevered. The smugness was quickly wiped from my face when I discovered PRIORESS was not the answer to 12ac. I really should have returned to 12ac as it was of course unparsed, but in my haste to finally finish I forgot to do so. To do the hard yards and then get tripped up by this is mega annoying! 🤬
7 ish minutes until I was left with 2d and 6d. 3 minutes later had biffed SECOND and FAUN. Should’ve seen RELOAD, but I had no idea where 6d was going. Thanks Wurm and Kitty.
Another DNF due to DAWN and RELOAD. 15 mins without those which is s good time for me, so mostly a fair and enjoyable puzzle. I have no complaints about the living person change; RELOAD beat me because it was a good clue with a good diversion, while DAWN beat me because it was a bad clue with a unnecessary ‘A’ at the beginning. I agree with others, particularly Cedric, on this being a terribly written clue.
Thanks Kitty for the blog and for making us all feel better that even our wonderful blogger could not finish!
DNF – another here that could not see DAWN – good luck with that if you are across the pond – I alphatrawled past D but skipped over W being the third letter. I too, had fun with RELOAD and TRADER but managed to tune into Wurm’s wavelength to that degree at least.
My ha’penn’orth – On the whole, I quite enjoy the living persons – it adds a new dimension to the format, but it does somewhat rely on such persons being known generally on a wider scale e.g. Obama and Biden would clearly be fair game as they are almost certainly known of around the globe, but Dawn French? It was a great clue, and I’d say allowable if the audience is UK-only… I just wonder if Ms French knows how much trouble she has caused!
How did the Crossword Genius get on with that one?
Thanks Wurm and Kitty for your valiant efforts
Crossword Genius knows it now. I just taught it. It generally struggles with cryptics where wordplay is absent. Don’t we all.
After this morning’s Dawn failure I remembered a more positive reference from Greek studies of many years ago :
“When the young Dawn with finger tips of rose” – meaning a beautiful sunrise.
Nice. I prefer that to the “Rosy-fingered dawn” translation that I’ve come across before.
Slow on RELOAD and DNF because of DAWN.
A DNF at the 40m cutoff failing on:
RELOAD – nice clue but too clever for me
TRADER – NHO as a ship
DAWN – along with many others I see
Note that the grid meant all of these had no first letter as a guide adding to the difficulty of already pretty hard clues.
HEIGHT – nice clue and I should have got this one
HAND – ditto
Otherwise it all rolled along nicely and COD to the highly amusing DICTATOR.
Thanks Wurm and Kitty for making me feel better.
DNF
Another DAWN, although the truth is I didn’t spot that it was missing from my paper answer until my delight at RELOAD brought me prematurely to Kitty’s fine blog. Then surprised to find I hadn’t (and wouldn’t have) got it.
Generally very good puzzle, but clearly a QC clue should not be tripping up so many.
Thanks Kitty and Wurm
Crikey! I join the DNF queue today. And a solve that turned out to be wrong.
Something I’ve learned in the year I’ve been doing these QCs is that “A French” always gives you UN or UNE. So I concentrated on ‘entertainer’ and decided it had to be FAUN, as in L’Après-midi d’un Faun. Did the faun entertain the vast public of the Ballets Russe? Yes! So in it went.
I got MACARONI (helpful clueing) so Wimbledon with -A— had to be lawn something… spent ages, and gave up. Ditto RELOAD – I thought of round of drinks and round of golf, but never made round of ammo. Several lessons learned.
Despite the frustrations, it was a fun challenge and whiled away 30 minutes while the Suffolk rain poured down incessantly. Time for a good book! Thanks to Wurm and to Kitty – whose admission of a DNF suddenly lifted my mood several notches!
Hello.
I am rather enthusiastically embracing the new rule aren’t I, but then if we don’t deploy it, why did we bother to change the regulations in the first place? There were only two today, Virginia Wade and Dawn French, so hopefully not TOO weighty a dollop served up.
As to ‘A French’, the A is there to avoid a DBE, as many notables (there’s a long list on Wiki) share that surname.
Thanks Kitty, thanks all for comments, see you next time.
And Damien? Or have I missed his demise?
Thanks for explaining the A reasoning.
Oops, yes, and Damian.
And I should have said, overall an enjoyable puzzle!
There were three – also HIRST
Indeed Horners, see comments above.
Something I’d like to point out about names is that use of same is nothing new in Times puzzles. All that’s changed is that we are now able to use names of living persons as well as names of those who have hopped the twig. Thus it shouldn’t really be all that big a deal, but I can see from comments both here and elsewhere that it is! Strange.
Nice to be able to directly thank a setter for the pleasure we’ve had from the crossword they’ve given us, so thank you!
We failed on DAWN too but no complaints and no problem with the new rule.
Mr SR said something a little similar to you, “If Dawn French had died last year would that have changed the clue at all?”.
Should add, of course, that we’re very pleased DF didn’t die last year.
Firstly, it’s good of you to drop by and comment.
I think the ‘unease’ about the use of living people is because the subset of ‘famous’ dead people (as far as crosswords is concerned) is reasonably well established, even if it does include Beerbohm Tree. The selection of those still around is naturally more subjective.
Just an idle thought but as far as I am concerned as long as they are in Wiki then they are famous enough. However there are A LOT of people in Wiki I NHO.
A definite nope on that one – for the same reason I would disagree if you said that any word in the dictionary is fair game. Only more so! That kind of fun is for barred puzzles only (and I enjoy a punishingly difficult Listener as much as the next crucivermasochist).
It would have been good to sound out the regular solvers who post, here, instead of imposing a change.
Overall, we would have resisted this move.
The q c worked well, before.
Thanks for joining in, Wurm. For what it’s worth I’m with those that like the rule change (although I wouldn’t want the flavour of the crosswords to change too much too fast). I don’t see why, for example, we should have to wait for PMs to go to the great parliament in the sky before they can be clued, when we know that they will eventually be. Entertainment personalities are always going to be a bit more of a judgement call as to whether they will stand the test of time as GK, but still. I don’t think alive/dead cuts it as the best metric there.
One thing with living people is that, being alive, they can find themselves in the crossword. As comments came in I kept envisaging them reaching DF …
“Hey, Dawn, you’re in a Times crossword. Ooh, there is a blog about it. Hmm, lots of discussion about whether you are famous enough. And whether it is a good thing that you are alive. No! Not like that …”
The new rule is not necessarily a bad idea. But the way it was used here suggests that The Times is willing to lose its non-British solvers.
Generally slow, steady progress but ultimately DNF DAWN. With hindsight (of course!) I feel I really should have solved this clue as, dare I say, I don’t feel it’s actually that tricky for UK solvers. I initially had ‘second’ for RELOAD but it just didn’t parse so eventually I went back to it and alphabet-trawled the letter between the O and D and it jumped out from there. Liked HEED and DICTATOR, both of which also held me up for some time. Tricky but satisfying start to the week. Thanks Kitty and Wurm.
Rattled through most if this, helped by weirdly remembering a discussion here some time ago about why Macaroni featured in Yankee Doodle. Obviously I then got stuck on 2d and 6d like everyone else. Reload was eventually a very pleasing pdm, but 6d continued to hide. Cue most of the morning spent thinking about *a*n. It was only when I considered that ‘A’ could be French for ‘has’ and then somehow jumping from Hasn to (Goldie) Hawn that I. . . er, saw the light and got Dawn. I’m sure the smug smile will fade. CoD to 2d, Reload. Invariant
Like everybody else I DNF, having given up on DAWN as I was trying to fit ‘un’ in and of course I couldn’t.
I had confidently entered ‘SECOND’ for 2D, my logic being based on boxing’s ’seconds out round 2,3 or whatever’ but I suppose that would have called for a plural solution and in any case it didn’t really parse.
I am fairly relaxed about the inclusion of living people as I have fortunately heard of everyone so far since the rule was changed. I do wonder, though, whether some of our overseas solvers will be aware of the more British-centric personalities.
Gave up at 20 minutes with 4 outstanding – 2, 5 & 6dn and 12ac. Of these I should definitely have got PRIMROSE but was too busy trying to make ‘princess’ parse. Ditto RELOAD where I wanted to put ‘second’ but couldn’t parse it. I thought of TRADER at 5dn but didn’t connect it with a ship so didn’t enter it. I also briefly considered DAWN during an alphabet trawl for 6dn but unfortunately there was no corresponding pdm. Liked DICTATOR (although nho murphy for potato) and WADE, my FOI. I have no particular concerns about the use of living people in crosswords. Obviously they have to be well known but then the same applies to all, living or dead.
Same here. I eventually got DAWN but failed to find RELOAD – I’m not a fan of a CD at the best of times, but one where there are so many meanings of ’round’ does seem a little unfair in a QC.
Apart from 6D, all done in four minutes. Nice puzzle as I do like a good cryptic, which reload was. I have no problems with 6D starting with A, which I think Wurm justifies nicely, except perhaps that it made the clue that much harder and many experience solvers didn’t get it. I’m quite happy to take that one on the chin.
Same story as most others – thought I was going to finish really quickly, then got held up by two; not HAND for bananas, which I saw straight away, but TRADER and DAWN. Got TRADER because, although if I had to write down 20 synonyms for ship it wouldn’t be one of them, I couldn’t think of anything else and, once it occurred to me that it might be the answer, I could see how it parsed; but I gave up with DAWN – that must have been a fun clue for our non-Brit solvers, since she’s hardly world famous and didn’t occur to a lot of us who would at least be aware of her existence.
EDIT – That will teach me not to read the whole blog – I got RELOAD wrong as well, rather stupidly with hindsight, because I couldn’t see how my biffed answer parsed and, when that is the case, it’s almost certainly wrong; I won’t say what I put in, too embarrassing.
I threw in RECORD to my shame.
A DNF chez SR today for the first time in a long time with both DAWN _and_ RELOAD. Thought RELOAD was a clever definition but I managed to convince myself that “second” could mean “get” (in the “second someone to a temporary role” sense) and, also, “next”, and then tailed off into “And “round” is the O and mentioned because…um…”.
Thought DAWN was a clever DD.
No problems with the new rule here despite possibly qualifying by age, at least, as a “gammon”. I’m afraid I don’t care for that term (even if it is cryptically clued) and lump it together in my mind with such delights as “Boomer”, “Karen” and “Snowflake”.
Many thanks (again) for the enjoyable crossword, Wurm, and for the entertaining and very much needed blog, Kitty.
DAWN a DD? I only see one.
And you’re right to see only one.
I meant CD, of course.
Thanks for the correction 😊
I was hoping you had another one to make it a more palatable clue for me!
DNF for the third time in a week. Nice to have some company! I had all but DAWN in ten minutes and gave up after another seven. Like Invariant, I remembered the helpful MACARONI discussion. Thanks Kitty and Wurm.
DAWN and TRADER led to DNF, kicked self ref. DAWN but TRADER was always going to be a stumper
Dnf…
I debated on 5dn “Trader” but stupidly dismissed it without properly parsing it. However, like everyone else, 6dn “Dawn” had me stumped, and I quickly exhausted my little knowledge of French comedians pursuing a path that maybe one was the equivalent of an “entertainer”. In the end, I also got 19dn wrong, putting “Elle” rather than “Ella”.
A tricky start to the week.
FOI – 11ac “Bond”
LOI – Dnf
COD – 12ac “Primrose”
Thanks as usual!