Times 26,657: Down With The NHS

A second puzzle in a row done by me, in defiance of human physiology and all else that is holy, first thing in the morning; but once more this left me with loads of change from a 10 minute time, so I won’t complain too hard.

This was the sort of puzzle that I think of as very Roganesque (though I stress I have no inside information to lead me to believe it’s by the editor himself) – highly intricate construction leading to smoothly deceptive surfaces of remarkable concision. A bunch of the down clues in particular caught my eye: 2dn, 4dn, 5dn, 15dn are all very very clever and the surfaces are beautiful. 8ac also gets an honourable mention just for having caught me, fair and square, in its trap: (1) “That’s not a US town!” (2) “Okay, I guess it is a US town too, but hmm anyway.” (3) “D’oh!”

There has been some discussion on the club forum already about whether 18dn might be too much of a stretch, and I think I would, in my professional capacity, tend to concur that a GUI is not the act of interfacing with the graphics by the user, but the graphics that are being interfaced with. But it’s still quite early and perhaps I have no idea what I’m talking about. So I’ll just say thanks to the setter, plus ask them, what have you got against the NHS? 7dn + 17dn + 14ac, don’t try to claim there wasn’t some kind of agenda here!

Across

1 In this sort of voting, job often involves delivery (6,6)
POSTAL BALLOT – POST [job] + A LOT [often] involves BALL [delivery]
8 One housed in semi: feller in US town (7)
HALIFAX – I [one] housed in HALF [semi] + AX [feller in US]
9 Description of playful Sir Hugo? (7)
ROGUISH – (SIR HUGO*) [“playful”], semi-&lit
11 Presentation of image less stuffy — almost plain (7)
PRAIRIE – P.R. [presentation of image] + AIRIE{r} [less stuffy, “almost”]
12 Sweat-covered man in middle of field finding shamrock? (7)
TREFOIL – REF [man in middle of field], covered by TOIL [sweat]
13 Confirm demise of vessel after shelling (3,2)
INK IN – {s}INKIN{g}
14 Random opium use not ultimately causing rash (9)
IMPETUOUS – (OPIUM USE {no}T*) [“randomly”]
16 Dolphins enjoy poking elderly relative affectionately (9)
GRAMPUSES – USE [enjoy] poking GRAMPS [elderly relative, affectionately]
19 Some knocked back tea — one guzzled port (5)
GENOA – reverse hidden in {te}A ONE G{uzzled}
21 Jumbo the setter’s set mostly to trap people (7)
IMMENSE – I’M [the setter’s] + SE{t}, to trap MEN [people]
23 Husband welcome, since brave (4-1-2)
HAVE-A-GO – H AVE AGO [husband | welcome | since]
24 Sailor who Roman knight would make legendary king (7)
TARQUIN – TAR [sailor] + QUI [who, “Roman”] + N [knight]. Lucky this didn’t begin “sailor whom Roman”, or it would have had to be TARQUEMN
25 Defiant remark: it follows comforting one (2,5)
SO THERE – SO [it follows] + THERE [comforting remark, as in “there, there”]
26 Young stand-in priest, purged of sin, insincere fellow (6,6)
PRINCE REGENT – PR [priest] + IN{sin}CERE + GENT [fellow]

Down

1 Fish appearing in dock reversed shortage (7)
POLLACK – LOP [dock] reversed + LACK [shortage]
2 Son with slight temperature avoids food colouring (7)
SAFFRON – S [son] + AFFRON{t} [slight (that) T for temperature “avoids”]
3 Tensions exist in a European novel (9)
ANXIETIES – (EXIST IN A E*) [“novel”]
4 Overenthusiastically toasted end of graduation in Lancaster? (5)
BURNT – {graduatio}N in BURT [Lancaster, actor]
5 Cut grey lining in case where pins are laid (3-4)
LEG-REST – GRE{y} lining LEST [in case]
6 Regularly used coercion, force, on foreign banker (7)
ORINOCO – {c}O{e}R{c}I{o}N {f}O{r}C{e} O{n}
7 Polish GP isn’t, unfortunately, everything you’d wish for (8,4)
SHOPPING LIST – (POLISH GP ISN’T*) [“unfortunately”]
10 Asserts much more than control (4,4,4)
HOLD SWAY OVER – HOLDS [asserts] + WAY OVER [much more than]
15 Quickly giving compere stick if introductions mixed up (9)
POSTHASTE – HOST PASTE [compere | stick] Spoonerised
17 One who digs dirt concealed by a doctor (7)
ADMIRER – MIRE [dirt] concealed by A DR
18 Swan interacting with mouse? New for a bird! (7)
PENGUIN – PEN [swan] + GUI [interacting with mouse, in a G{raphical} U{ser} I{nterface}] + N [new]
19 Dance music in Lent is too much (7)
GAVOTTE – in GAVE [Lent] is O.T.T. [too much]
20 Rat seen moving extremely close (7)
NEAREST – (RAT SEEN*) [“moving”]
22 German I note raised boy (5)
ERNIE – EIN RE [German I | note] raised

58 comments on “Times 26,657: Down With The NHS”

  1. 8:37. Very nice puzzle, I agree.
    I had the same thought about HALIFAX, but moved on before I got to the ‘doh!’ stage.
    I think 18dn is OK. The idea that a GUI is just ‘the graphics being interfaced with’ doesn’t make sense to me: surely the interface is the whole point? So it’s a description of a system for human-computer interaction, as is ‘interacting with mouse’. Mind you I’m about as far from being an expert on this as it’s possible to be.
    I raised an eyebrow a bit at the descripton of SAFFRON as a ‘food colouring’. If I just wanted to make food yellow I would use something with a less pervasive flavour, and much, much cheaper.

    Edited at 2017-02-24 08:57 am (UTC)

    1. I guess the, um, key feature of a CLI is that you’re going to need a keyboard to use it; and the key feature of a GUI is that you can navigate it using a mouse. So the clue is definitely quite clever. I still think, reflexively, that the GUI is a navigable thing rather than the navigation itself, but there’s enough doubt in my mind now that I’ll let it slide!
      1. I think the question mark gives enough leeway. Certainly my programmer side was happy enough with the clue once I’d got there!
      2. I’ll take your word for it: I get there partly just because ‘interacting’ is a perfectly good synonym for ‘interface’, but of course that doesn’t necessarily reflect how people actually use the word GUI. Having considered the matter fullly I think the right approach to this question is to stop worrying about it and have a drink.
          1. I agree it’s a bit loose. A WIMP interface is a GUI but not all GUIs are WIMPs… and indeed decreasingly so. I still use a mouse but touchcreeens or touchpads (not to mention voice input) will surely make them extinct by the 2020s. But, like keriothe, I still liked the clue.

            Edited at 2017-02-24 06:41 pm (UTC)

        1. Talking of which, I’ve (temporarily) stopped trying to organise any grandiose Sloggers & Betters meetups, but we should definitely go the pub on a smaller scale again sometime…
          1. Yes, would definitely be up for that. Not this evening though. School quiz night. Very important.
            1. Actually (non-school) quiz nights might be a good place to gather crosswordy types together. I won the last pub quiz I went to, in South Norwood a couple of Mondays ago, but mostly by dint of my obscure knowledge contributing the last few points to push us over the top. It’s the people who can win (or almost win) quizzes singlehandedly that you need to find and get on your team at any cost…
              1. We had one of those, but her youngest went to secondary school this year so we are in trouble.
  2. Well apart from an embarrassing flirtation with SHIPPING SLOT for 7dn (yes, it really is a thing; you put a container in it…) I fairly sailed through this one. I’d never heard of a GRAMPUS before, and for some reason it took ages to see PRAIRIE, my LOI.

    15 would be my COD, though I wonder if the wordplay works for the one-word version of POSTHASTE? How can it have two introductions?

    1. When Arsene Wenger arrived at The Arsenal some 20 seasons ago he came from a Japanese FC (Nagoya) known as Grampus Eight. In those days their logo was a dolphin – it has since been modified. Having an enquiring mind I checked 16ac GRAMPUSES (GRAMPUSI?)out at the time and have never forgotten it. My COD.

      36 minutes for an excellent Friday puzzle.

      2dn SAFFRON to me is an essential food colouring for the old paella.

      FOI 9ac ROGUISH LOI 22dn ERENIE

      Did not fuully parse 18dn PENGUIN as GUI was unknown but it seemed to follow the aquatic themette.

      WOD 1dn POLLACK who oftentimes comes on as a sub for Cod in Bird’s Eyes Fish Fingers.

  3. 12:00 … ending with ANXIETIES.

    The INK IN clue is a thing of beauty. Nice finish to a nice week of puzzle. Thanks, all.

  4. Top class crossword, this .. lots of delightful clues. My favourite was 3dn, such a beautiful construction and surface. 2dn also notable
  5. Great puzzle – no obscure words just first class constructions and misdirection

    No problem with GUI – no need surely to get too technical. Thought INK IN and ANXIETIES the best of a really good bunch. Thank you setter and well blogged V

  6. Apparently this saying comes from an order by magistrates to whip all beggars out of the two towns mentioned, and not the quality of Yorkshire hospitality as seen by a Lancastrian. Thinking about it, the two are very similar. There was a welcoming gibbet in both towns too, which may be why Hell got included. A merciful release, some would say. After the old dog and I managed a pleasant walk across the Common in sunshine, I zoomed through this in just under 20 minutes with LOI LEG REST. COD INK IN, which gave that smug feeling of satisfaction.
      1. That’s not in the rules, Pip. Only Lankies can insult Yorkies, and vice versa. We stand together aginst the rest of the world.
      1. Beautiful, John. My confession is that my surname, Uttley, is Yorkie. My gggrandfather moved out of Hebden Bridge to Manchester in 1850. We’re from Heptonstall, the land that time forgot.
        1. A old University friend of mine, originally from Haslingden, lived most of his life in Halifax(he’s gone sun seeking in North Devon now as his wife refused to cope with the northern winters anymore, as the snow plough wouldn’t come along the lane to their isolated farmhouse) and has triplet daughters, whose 30 birthday is tomorrow. They’re congregating from around the country and having a party in Leeds to celebrate. My surname is Dunleavy(Irish obviously) but I’m delighted that Middlesbrough has been reassigned to North Yorkshire rather than the artificial construct it used to be in.
          1. Too right. It was that philistine Heath that did it, as well as causing mega-inflation. Let’s have Lancashire and Yorkshire back intact, Statham and Trueman, Morecambe and Wise, and many, many more, the real northern powerhouses.
  7. Probably about 40mins or so, very satisfying to finish. GUI the only unknown here, so PENGUIN went in with a shrug, and GRAMPUSES sort of half-known. Great misdirections all around: the ‘One who digs’=’minor’ trap, and the ‘slight temperature’=’1F’ one held me up for some time.

    1. I should confess at this stage that, at the point I entered GUI, my thought process was “could that conceivably be the name of some kind of obscure Asian rodent? I bet it could, good enough for me!”
  8. Echoing remarks above, a fine puzzle, 29 minutes, liked HALIFAX and BURNT especially. I had thought a GRAMPUS was more of a whale thing than a dolphin, so have learnt something new today.
  9. 39 minutes was quite respectable for me without actually achieving my target half-hour. Pleased to know GUI and not sufficiently versed in the technicalities to worry if it didn’t fit exactly. Lost a little time with HAVE SWAY OVER before realising that a word meaning “shamrock” and ending with a V would be unlikely, so I needed to rethink that corner of the grid.
  10. After a few weeks abroad this was just what I needed. Excellent My late wife who worked in computer graphics always said that GUI was devised for me and stood for Gross User Incompetence.
    1. No, my late wife was not called “Excellent”. I forgot to put in a Full stop. Further evidence of GUI she would have said.
  11. Having been at home for the school half term holidays this week I’ve had a more relaxed approach to solving. Possibly this helped me enjoy the scenery today as I found plenty to admire. INK IN, POSTHASTE and PENGUIN in particular stood out for me. Back to solving on the commute and slapdash errors on Monday!
  12. 25 min, but finished by biffing HALF SEAS OVER at 10dn, which fits all the checkers, but has no relation to the clue. 🙁
  13. A most enjoyable puzzle which I thought at first was going to be a slog, as I struggled to get a foothold, but then found myself all done in 29:13. FOI, BURNT and LOI, ERNIE. As has been said a masterpiece of succinct(definitely not pronounced sussinct) and misdirecting clueing. Thanks setter and V.
  14. This has been a weird week for me, with my place in the pecking order bouncing around like a pinball under Tommy’s direction. Today was a way down the list day at 23.30, for no particular reason except either excellent and misleading cluing directed at all my weaknesses, or cyclical density on my part.
    There were times when I felt none of the clues made sense or were open to parsing. GUI and its meaning, whatever it technically means, made no attempt to collide in the solving part of my brain. ERNIE I sort of got, wondering how I in German got to be EIN (via Latin, as it turns out).
    On the other hand, lent and gave have often turned out to be the same in my experience, much to the depletion of Z8 resources.

    Edited at 2017-02-24 12:31 pm (UTC)

    1. I hadn’t even stopped to think that EIN was German for ONE rather than for I! Perhaps this qualifies as indirection… but as liberties with cluing go you couldn’t get much more venial than this one, I expect.
    2. 25:16 I too got stuck on trying to find a name ending in ICH. Anyone for ERICH, perhaps? Stalled on parsing PRAIRIE and dithered over same for GRAMPUSES which was only half remembered, which delayed me a couple of minutes to miss my target time for the first time this week. Excellent puzzle and illuminating blog, as ever. Thanks.
  15. Over an hour I’m afraid with a complete seizure in the NW. Once I’d consulted some help and got ANXIETIES it all fell into place. Didn’t help that I had POLLOCK – didn’t know about POLLACK. Is it the same fish? As above, I have serious misgivings about LENT = GAVE.
    1. I wouldn’t try to Google “pollock/pollack” if I were you – after a few links assuring me things like “the pollock is not the same fish as the pollack! But there is a third unrelated Scottish fish called the pollack, which is also referred to locally as pollock”, I’m more confused than ever.
  16. Very much enjoyed this. Finished within my hour, just. I would have been quicker but for some stupid reason had written “SAFFONT” instead of SAFFRON, and didn’t spot it for a while. I was halfway through the coffee by then, so no excuse. Other dopinesses included briefly wondering what a “bunt” was and what it had to do with Lancaster…

    Things that didn’t help: Not knowing who TARQUIN was, and never having heard of GRAMPUSES or POLLACKs.

    Things that helped: remembering GAVOTTE from a previous appearance.

    Thanks to setter and blogger. A nice way to finish a week.

    Edited at 2017-02-24 12:54 pm (UTC)

  17. Double yesterday’s time but I doubt I would have finished this six months ago so I am not despondent. Not a clue about GUI, but then where computer related matters are concerned I am very much in the ‘plug and play’ bracket. Computing’s acronym sausage machine has been a real boon to setters in recent times.
  18. Agree with all the comments re an enjoyable puzzle. I had the same pollock/pollack lack of knowledge, and would have been under 45 minutes if I had spelled roguish properly. Mixed moment of the day was feeling pleased with immediately seeing what 13ac was looking for, then sticking ‘it’ in in place of ‘in’
  19. 27 minutes, but a U too many at 9 across, typoing ‘ruguish’. Excellent stuff – and pleasing to escape the obsessive anti-Trumpery of the Guardian, even if seldom now visited,
      1. Yes, these darned inventions of the media that have gained acceptance through centuries of use.
  20. Got through in around 30 minutes, and agree this is an excellent puzzle. I don’t have a useful opinion on the GUI discussion, as I had no idea what it meant. So I threw the answer in because it seemed the only thing possible. My LOI’s were the crossing at SAFFRON/PRAIRIE. Thanks to the setter, Verlaine, and regards to all.
  21. 20 mins. I drifted slightly mid-solve but I can’t say it affected my time too much. Having said that, I was slow to see some answers that, in retrospect, should have been as good as write-ins, such as ROGUISH, IMPETUOUS, POSTHASTE, GRAMPUSES and SHOPPING LIST. HOLD SWAY OVER was my LOI. I didn’t do myself any favours by being certain that the “much more than” in the clue was going to be OVER rather than the eventual WAY OVER.
  22. If you needed a system that allowed a swan to interact with a mouse , you would design a pen-gui
  23. A beautiful puzzle and it’s not the setter’s fault that after understanding that 5dn would be GRE(Y) inside LEST I still managed to put in LOG REST, a technical device used by lumberers of course, who call their logs “pins”. Oh well, at least the rest was right and I did understand most of the wordplay (except how the US acquired Halifax from Canada).
  24. 15:54 for me, too tired to really enjoy this one. (It didn’t feel like one of Richard Rogan’s to me, but perhaps I’ll go back to it later. Maybe I’ll change my mind after I’ve recovered a little.)

    Like others I was badly held up by HALF SEAS OVER. I thought of this with just the H and L of the first word in place, and assumed that the other checked letters would eliminate it in due course. When they didn’t, I wasted a ridiculous amount of time trying to justify it.

    PS (written after looking at the puzzle again when a lot less tired):
    Another first-rate puzzle. I only wish I hadn’t been so ruddy tired on Friday as I’d have enjoyed it so much more then – but at least I was able to go back to it today.

    However, I still suspect this wasn’t one of RR’s puzzles. In fact I think I recognise the fine Italian hand of another Times setter (whose identity I sadly don’t know). Just a feeling in my water – I could be quite wrong.

    Edited at 2017-02-26 11:51 am (UTC)

  25. OK — what do regular bloggers here use as the argot for “bunging in from the crossers” (analogous to the BIFD)? I see several experienced solvers wrote in HALF SEAS OVER on the basis of a couple of the H, L, S, A…etc even when nothing in the clue that I can see justified it.
  26. Oh… and as someone who does these puzzles with a Bic biro on a tattered sheet of newsprint, I must say how useful I find Verlaine’s presentation of the solutions. Having the clues set out in the blog, with the def underlined, makes it possible for me to follow the solution even when I’ve recycled the back page of the Times, or left it in the cafe, or stuffed it inside my wet walking boots. And V’s coding for anagrams, “regularly” tricks, hiddens, etc. is really clear and concise. Thank you!

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