Times 25793 – pick your clue for 17 down – I recommend the first one

Solving time : 15:56 – relieved to have it all correct, but frustrated along the way by the online puzzle hanging for a while, and then there being two clues catenated for 17 down. I thought it was one long complicated clue and was wondering if something like ALGIL EGIA was a thing.

There’s still two I don’t quite understand when coming to write up the blog, I think I know what is going on with 7 down, but I suspect 5 down, which went in on enumeration and thinking it was a plausible answer for one half of the clue.

I’m on the road most of the day tomorrow, so any flubs I make will take a while to be corrected – you might want to check the comments if you have disagreements.

Away we go…

Across
1 PAGODA: the old man being worshipped could be a PA GOD, then A
4 ANGSTROM: R in (AMONGST)*
10 CLOSE DOWN: C(hickens) which LOSE DOWN
11 ADIOS: I in SODA reversed
12 ERA: hidden in firttER Away
13 BAKED,ALASKA
14 EDISON: NO SIDE reversed
16 YARDAGE: EGAD,RAY all reversed
19 AEROBIC: (COBRA,I.E.)*
20 WASH UP: H in WAS UP (so now down)
22 SPEND A PENNY: go being the lavatorial sense
25 LIP: double definition
26 TIGHT: double definition (one being drunk)
27 TWEENAGER: WEE,N(ell) in (GREAT)*
28 TEN,DRIL(l)S
29 ISRAEL: take the sides off of DISRAELI
 
Down
1 POCKET: double definition – the other one referring to snooker/pool
2 GOOSANDER: 0,OS in GANDER
3 DWEEB: D(irect) then E in WEB
5 NINE DAYS’ WONDER: aaah – Google to the rescue, she was only queen for nine days
6 SMALL ARMS: MALLARM(e) in SS
7 RE,INS: got this from the definition (after much agonizing) – INS can refer to Inerial Navigation System which can be used to control the movement of ships Edit: as pointed out in comments, it’s also a term for kidneys… though I rather like my convoluted wordplay suggestion so I’m keeping it here
8 MUSCADET: SUM reversed, then CADET
9 WORKING CAPITAL: ROW reversed, then KING, CAPITAL(initial)
15 SUBEDITOR: BED in SUITOR
17 ACQUILEGIA: LEG in two I’s in AQUA
18 MARSH TIT: T in MARS HIT
21 SPIRAL: (PARIS)*, (morta)L
23 ELGIN: G in NILE reversed
24 YONKS: YON, then KISS without IS

31 comments on “Times 25793 – pick your clue for 17 down – I recommend the first one”

  1. I figured the second part is an editor’s comment that didn’t get deleted. If you assume the original clue was “Couple must wrap …” this sort of makes sense. The enumeration is a puzzle though.
  2. I took this as a dd: reins=power, reins=kidneys (‘water regulators’). Rather archaic for a daily but.
  3. I just now noticed that 17d had 2 enumerations; I managed to overlook the correct (9) and try to come up with a 5,4, and one that had to do with II to boot; which is what I’d like to do to the printer. I remembered that Lady Jane didn’t keep her job long, although I didn’t remember the 9 days, but the enumeration sufficed. For some reason I threw in ‘pilfer’ at 1d (had the P), which made 10ac my LOI. REINS would be my COD, although I can see objections. 24d was nice, too.
  4. I think Kevin has it re REINS. But agree that it’s a bit obscure.

    Wondered why Lady Jane was “amazing” — but it’s probably just an indication for WONDER.

    Yep, I tried a (5,4) at 17dn until I saw what was going on. If I’m right, it’s the second time this has happened under the new regime.

    Edited at 2014-05-22 05:27 am (UTC)

  5. 23 minutes, most of them spent in the NE where I shuddered to a complete halt with the crossing pair at 7 and 11. I’d been doing well up to that point, but couldn’t get past tea as a non-alcoholic drink and that lexical earworm ICU at the end. Once I got REINS in, it seemed perfectly OK, if a bit Authorised Version: Psalms 139:13: For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother’s womb. Um – “couple” a bit indirect for II (5,4) as the editor might say.
    Up to that point, a rather enjoyable romp, even allowing for the second excursion in a week for TWEENAGER. Quoting myself from the forum, that’s a word that “shouldn’t exist in any self-respecting vocabulary”.
    AQUILEGIA constructed entirely from the cryptic – glad to see it exists and indeed that it’s one I’ve actually seen. Next time, I’ll call it by name.

    Edited at 2014-05-22 06:55 am (UTC)

    1. I rather like the word TWEENAGER. I have a ten-year-old daughter, so I find it pretty useful. And I love the definition in Chambers.
    2. I didn’t realize when I put a comment up on the Club forum that you’d got there before me here on “reins”. It took a while for me to dredge up the KJ association but it popped up in the end. I’d have got there a bit sooner if this had been a TLS puzzle where it might have been expected. Yes, the NE was hard indeed, especially after I tore through the rest of it. 17.45

  6. I plumped for ‘rains’ (despite being able to speak French), without really knowing why, and in my haste to complete in under 30mins (my target), I submitted without filling in MARSH TIT. That would’ve taken me over, but I guess I would’ve probably got it in the end…

    Had yarrafa (momble) as an unfamiliar mild expletive at 16a until I got MUSCADET. Might adopt it…

    The clueing for AQUILIEGIA was so clear that I assumed the ed’s comment and incorrect (and additional) enumeration was an oversight, and moved swiftly on.

  7. So at 19dn we have yet another example of incompetence when posting on-line a puzzle that’s correct in the newspaper. The number of errors that have occurred recently suggests a slapdash approach in which lessons are never learned from previous mistakes. The inclusion of the editor’s comment is one thing, but having two different enumerations for the same clue raises the incompetence to a new level as one doesn’t even have to think about the clue and understand it to see that something must be amiss.

    That aside, this was a rather good puzzle with clever cluing such as 15dn and 20ac, both of which gave me pause for thought although the literal answers were pretty obvious. I didn’t know TWEENAGER a week ago but it came up somewhere only the other day.

    I didn’t spend much time considering 7dn as the error already mentioned led me not to trust the clue necessarily to be correct. Given the checkers, “water/regulators” had to be RAINS or REINS so I plumped for the latter.

    Edited at 2014-05-22 06:09 am (UTC)

  8. 22m, with a long time agonising over 7dn. I saw it quite quickly (mostly because I speak French) but just couldn’t believe it so considered every other possibility before putting it in.
    Other than that, and the error in 17dn, I liked this puzzle a lot. Not much that could just be bunged in from definition, and a nice variety of references, with Lady Jane Grey, ANGSTROM, AQUILEGIA, DWEEB and YONKS in the same puzzle.
  9. 18:50 … looks like I picked the right day to switch to treeware.

    Agonised over REINS, of course, but finally assumed it was some equestrian joke beyond my ken and bunged it in. Otherwise, all understood and enjoyed.

    I’m reading the late Leo Marks’ Between Silk and Cyanide and have just reached the part where he’s putting on a show of dimness by ostentatiously struggling to solve a single clue in The Times crossword. “I asked for their help with one across, ‘just to get me started’, but none was forthcoming. I then enquired if they were any good at anagrams as I was hopeless at them myself … I wasn’t quite as stuck as I hoped to appear because I’d set the puzzle myself, a paying hobby I’d indulged in at St Paul’s as a substitute for homework.”

    Does anyone happen to know: Apart from his being unconscionably smart (for which I forgive him as he’s funny about it), is he the youngest setter to date? And the only school-age setter?

    1. I can’t help with your queries but I suspect the answer to both is ‘yes’. I’ve read the book and admire Marks who had a fascinating career in a number of fields including screen writing. He took part in a 1997 documentary called “Peeping Tom – A Very British Psycho” which I can thoroughly recommend if you ever get a chance to see it.
      1. I’d heard of the notorious film (of course) but not the documentary. Thanks, jackkt. I’ll look out for it. He’s definitely someone to be filed under “extraordinary life”. You couldn’t, wouldn’t make it up.
        1. John Henderson (Enigmatist) had his first puzzle published in the Guardian when he was 15. So there’s at least one other.
  10. 8:45 – we have a garden full of AQUILEGIAs so no problems with that one once I’d worked out which part was the correct clue. Small typo – you have a rogue C in your AQUILEGIA!

    I quite liked 10a. Thanks to setter and blogger.

  11. 17 mins, with the last two of them trying, fortunately unsuccessfully, to think of an alternative to REINS at 7dn. I’d completely forgotten the kidneys definition although I had come across it before. The devious ADIOS was my previous answer and I agree with Z8 that 11ac/7dn were a difficult pair of crossers. I should have seen AQUILEGIA quicker than I did because I was only talking to my mother about them yesterday as we were enjoying the sun in her back garden.
  12. 26m, thankfully having not been too distracted by the two clues in 17D. I can’t say I was surprised by this technical error given experience. Currently the Quick Cryptic on Android always has the letters from the day before in the grid, which is fixed by use of a slow, unresponsive Reset button.

    Griping aside I found this relatively gentle just slowing in the NE corner towards the end. I worried that I was going to repeat recent form of throwing something wrong in at the end without parsing but thankfully REINS proved correct and I hadn’t made up ANGSTROM.

  13. 11.30 but
    brain said muscadet and hand wrote in muscatel probably because I was pondering next clue. Don’t think it would have happened in a harder puzzle. Last two ADIOS and REINS (which I tried and failed to see as a triple definition but it seemed most likely).
  14. Agree that REINS is a bit obscure but I knew it from my schoolboy efforts to translate the Jane Birkin/Serge Gainsbourg song Je t’aime moi non plus. There was discussion at the time about how much the musicians paid for being at that recording.

    Edited at 2014-05-22 11:23 am (UTC)

  15. 17 down printed correctly in the Irish edition. Under half an hour, with the last ten minutes looking at REINS which I bunged in as fitting the definition, but the kidney reference was beyond me. Another enjoyable puzzle.
  16. For a long time I had WATTS instead of REINS because watts is hidden inside WATer regulaTorS.
  17. Came to this late in the day, can’t see any issue with 17 dn in the online puzzle, it just says “I twice must wrap limb in water plant(9).” Quite enjoyed it, ending with ADIOS and REINS once the now obvious MUSCADET clicked. 30 minutes while watching the Wentworth golf.
  18. Wow – I thought the site would be full of 10 mins ‘this was easy’ comments so I’m dead chuffed (as they say up t’North) with my 44 mins. Angstrom and Reins were (now obviously) intelligent guesses. I was pretty stupid with 17dn though – realised it was the first clue but was working to the second set of brackets – (5,4) doh!
  19. Sympathies to all those having problems with the on-line version. On paper, a pleasant and at times amusing solve, except the obscure REINS, of course. Entered, but without full knowledge or confidence. Had dimly heard of a GOOSANDER, but looked it up just to make sure – it sounded too convenient for crossword purposes. TWEENAGER a hideous new formation – what’s wrong with “little girl”? Also, didn’t spot the hidden ERA – entered it, but “unparsed”. Home based today, so timings tricky. Under 40 minutes, with many breaks.

    FOI ANGSTROM, LOI YARDAGE (chased contentedly down the rabbit hole of trying to remember how the Billy Bunter expletive “Yaroo” should be spelled). COD to the very pretty Columbine, or AQUILEGIA.

  20. Although Lady Jane Grey reigned for 9 days and the clue sort of makes sense, I was always under the impression that “9 days’ wonder” referred to the actor Will Kempe, who fell out with Shakespeare so he Morris danced all the way from London to Norwich in 9 days as a publicity stunt.
    His life was described in a one-man show by Chris Harris who sadly died only a few weeks ago.
  21. 16:28 for me, about half of it spent agonising over 7dn. Although I knew REINS could mean “kidneys” (though I’ve met it only rarely other than in crosswords), I simply didn’t think of it at the time, and chose REINS in the end on the basis that it matched “regulator”, assuming that “power” somehow indicated a homonym. Like Olivia, I suspect I’d have spotted the required meaning more readily if it had appeared in a TLS puzzle.

    Apart from that, it was reasonably plain sailing.

  22. I got through all bar 7d pretty briskly, but declined to enter ‘reins’ as I could not parse it. So I walked the dog and gave the matter full consideration, but still couldn’t psrse it so I bunged in the correct answer in hope rather than with confidence. I may have encountered ‘reins’ as kidneys in the deep past, but certainly did not remember that meaning. I think that it is doubly difficult to have an obscure term. which then has to be derived from the cryptic definition ‘water regulator’. Nonetheless, an enjoyable puzzle.

Comments are closed.