Quick Cryptic 3177 by Jalna

I’m solving and blogging today from my seat at the southern end of Adelaide Oval.  I won’t provide live updates (oh, well bowled Paddy!!!) but it’s Day 4 of the Third Test and at this moment the Ashes are still up for grabs.

I completed this one from Jalna in a slightly-distracted 5:53.  There were a couple of tough-ish definitions and some chewy wordplay, exactly how we like them on a Saturday morning, no?

How did you go with it?

(In the clues, definitions are underlined and anagram indicators are in bold italics.  In the explanations (ABC)* indicates an anagram of abc.  Deletions and other devices are indicated accordingly, I hope).

Across
7 Take out fruit (4)
DATE – Double definition

Date as in a romantic assignation.

8 Passing remarks? (8)
OBITUARY – Cryptic definition
9 Addendum to document provided by McCann execs (6)
ANNEXE – Hidden in (provided by) mccANN EXEcs
10 Stout bar surrounding barrel (6)
ROTUND – ROD (bar) surrounding TUN (barrel)
11 Rubbish is, in the first instance, going to decay (4)
GROT – G [first letter of (in the first instance) Going] + ROT (decay)

Mainly used in my experience in relation to a dirty person, especially a child, but the first dictionary I looked at had “something dirty, unpleasant or of poor quality”.  Like a Ben Stokes tattoo.

12 Get a role playing intimate friend (5,3)
ALTER EGO – (GET A ROLE)*

Again, I would normally associate this term with a Clark Kent style alternate identity, but the dictionaries also have “an intimate and trusted friend”.

15 Sparkly silver items thoughtlessly dropped? (8)
AGLITTER – AG (silver) + LITTER (items thoughtlessly dropped)
17 Spring festival primarily hosted on Long Island (4)
HOLI – Initial letters (primarily) of Hosted On Long Island

Hindu festival

18 Mechanic ultimately has favourable opinion of battered cars (6)
CRATES – C [last letter of (ultimately) mechaniC] + RATES (has favourable opinion of)
21 A child’s party? (6)
PERSON – A (per) + SON (child)

Rooms for fifty pounds a night / per night.

Party = a person or group taking one side of a question, dispute or contest.

22 Frank blog entry with influence (8)
POSTMARK – POST (blog entry) + MARK (influence)
23 Is required to pay co-owners on a regular basis (4)
OWES – Alternate letters (on a regular basis) of cO-oWnErS
Down
1 When travelling, grandma tours one American high street (4,4)
MAIN DRAG – (GRANDMA)* “tours” I (one)

We use this expression in Australia too.

2 Fairly new part of leisure centre (6)
RECENT – Hidden in (part of) leisuRE CENTre
3 Prediction on behalf of English players (8)
FORECAST – FOR (on behalf of) + E (English) + CAST (players)
4 One securing bank of stadium seats (4)
TIER – Double definition

Someone securing or tying something could be a “tier”.

5 Part of drain clogged in the middle, say (6)
GUTTER – G (middle letter of cloGged) + UTTER (say)
6 Make endlessly healthy food (4)
BRAN – BRANd (make) without the last letter (endlessly)
13 What takes a toll on America? Go Fish (8)
TURNPIKE – TURN (go) + PIKE (fish)

In the USA a turnpike is a motorway on which a toll is charged.

14 Girl ran, ran fast (8)
GALLOPED – GAL (girl) + LOPED (ran fast)
16 Entirely enthusiastic about toys with 50 per cent off (2,4)
IN TOTO – INTO (enthusiastic about) + TO (TOys with 50 per cent off)
17 What may be used in cultivating privileged pupils here (6)
HARROW – Double definition

The second one more an indicator than a definition.

19 Bird heading away from stream (4)
ROOK – bROOK (stream) without the first letter (heading away)
20 Hands over change (4)
SWAP – PAWS (hands) inverted (over)

65 comments on “Quick Cryptic 3177 by Jalna”

  1. Definitely tricky in the SW. Saw the a=per fortunately but I’m sure it will catch some out. Thought I was looking for Frank=open until the penny dropped. IN TOTO, SWAP and ROOK my last ones in. COD to PERSON.
    Thanks G and setter.

  2. Fans of Reggie Perrin will have had no problem with GROT as the name of his multi-million pound retail empire that sold nothing but useless rubbish.

    18 minutes, so another missed extended target. I didn’t know (or had forgotten HOLI) which slowed me in the SW segment and for some reason I took ages to see PERSON and HARROW even though I was born and bred within its borough.

  3. Just popping in to say that I’m very happy to see this was solved and blogged from the Oval. I was there myself yesterday. 😊

    1. Fantastic! Hope you enjoyed the day Jalna. I (and many Australians) think that it’s our best Test venue in terms of the overall experience. And coming from Perth I also get to enjoy the 5,000 km drive!

      BTW you did well to avoid the scorching heat of the first two days.

      1. BTW, that response was based on the assumption that you’re visiting from the UK. It just occurred to me that you might be Australian-based in which case I’m not telling you anything you don’t already know.

        1. Ha, no worries. I’m now Aus-based, but only as of this year, and in Adelaide with the in-laws for Christmas. It was my first time at the Oval, and it’s a fantastic venue. A great place to watch cricket, even when you’re watching Australia slowly bat their way off into the distance! 😬

      2. It’s a wonderful ground that I’ve visited many times over many years, and remember it in the days before the redevelopment, too. Very envious that you were there – I had to make do with half-dozing/half-listening to TMS all night. I was hoping England would be competitive in this series, it’s a real shame.
        Anyway, the resulting tiredness today didn’t affect my enjoyment of an excellent crossword – 10 mins of fun. Thanks J+G
        (ps you didn’t really drive from Perth, did you?)

  4. Found this very difficult. Reassured that Snitch is currently 187, highest on record. Thanks Galspray. Sadly not sure Ashes are still up for grabs

  5. Only had 20 minutes on offer and DNF in that time, PERSON, IN TOTO and BRAN still unsolved.
    Having now read blog all entirely fair- though cleverly crafted and easily sent those such as Himself and I up garden paths. Totally missed required connections between ‘party/person, ‘make/brand’. We were still in pinata and kale land at sign off -way off track.
    Thank you Jalna and Galspray

  6. Tricky, particularly in the SW where I had to employ the crowbar, but I enjoyed the challenge (less so the cricket). I was slightly surprised by the definition for ALTER EGO and took far too long to get the right sense of ‘frank’, as it’s one of those ones that comes up from time to time.

    Started with DATE and finished with SWAP in 12.06.
    Thanks to Galspray and Jalna

  7. Maybe I was just having a dumb day but I found this a real struggle and needed a couple of cheats to sort out the last few clues. Didn’t like Person and couldn’t parse Tier, so thanks, Jalna, for the explanation. Initially had Crocks before realising it was Crates. Well, if something rocks, you really rate it.

  8. Never heard of ‘main drag’. I would have thought that most people think of alter ego as ones other self – i would suggest that this other usage is obscure. Also the cluing for person is a bit strong for a quickie in my opinion. Enjoyed the rest though so thanks setter and blogger!

  9. 2:29 which is a completely impossible number for me to achieve so I’ll have to leave it up to four chaps tomorrow…but it is how close I came to taking a seat in the SCC today.
    To be totally frank I struggled with 16d and 22a
    Ta GAJ

  10. 27:46. Found this very difficult and needed a few cheats to avoid a DNF. Biffed HOLIDAY, BRAN, PERSON, GUTTER, IN TOTO. A real struggle, mirroring England in Adelaide. Gloom.

  11. Dnf…

    Under time pressure this morning due to various things going on and failed miserably. Not sure if it’s being tired, in a rush or that it was pretty hard – but I just couldn’t get anywhere with it.

    Didn’t help I put “Cranks” for 18ac.

    FOI – 7ac “Date”
    LOI – Dnf
    COD – 3dn “Forecast” – the prediction isn’t good I’m afraid.

    Thanks as usual!

    1. I have come around to your belief that Saturday puzzles are harder. I need to review the stats but the last few certainly seem to have been

      1. Oddly, I thought they were getting easier – and I am sure I have improved since they first started. However, I am always under time pressure on a Saturday to complete them and I have to do them on the iPad via the Crossword Club which is a bit of a mind shift from doing them on paper during the week.

        Only a week or so to go and I can see my stats for the year. Based on my running spreadsheet – there has been a definite improvement over the last three years since I recorded my times.

  12. DNF. Like others I’ve little time available today which seems a real shame as a quick look at the blog suggests I’ve missed a gem. Perhaps there’ll be an opportunity later today to go back and appreciate all that I’ve missed.
    Thanks to Jalna and Galspray.

    Note to self: Don’t attempt puzzles when short of time!

  13. I found this very hard, eventually limping home in 34:53. Spent too long trying to shoe-horn AITCHES into 15a, and SWAP took forever to come as my LOI.

    Thanks to Jalna and Galspray.

  14. My comments don’t need me to write them. Karla has already said it all.
    I found this very hard before setting it aside (in order to complete ceiling repairs and fit and re-wire a ceiling lamp on a three-switch circuit in a difficult position). Perhaps I will join Doofers when/if I come back to it.
    I spent a few minutes and got a handful of answers and wondered if I was trying to solve the wrong puzzle.

  15. 20:03 – my first visit to the SCC for a long while. A very enjoyable and challenging puzzle. SWAP was my LOI.

    Thanks Galspray and Jalna

  16. 9.37

    Some excellent clues here – PERSON; OBITUARY among others. But tricky in parts as well. Amusing blog (grits teeth). Real shame (and shock) it’s been so one-sided, but Carey Starc and Head have been out of this world good – pretty much won the thing on their own. 🤷‍♂️🚀😩

  17. Torn between admiring the clues and surprise at what Jalna thinks is appropriate for a QC. What goes through a setter’s mind when filling the grid and facing H-L-? “Ah yes, there are well over 30 common words I could use, but a Hindu festival is just the word for a QC, I’m sure they will all know it”. At least Jalna gave us straightforward wordplay for it, and just as well, as otherwise I’d have had no idea, but I must say I do prefer straightforward answers clued by clever wordplay (eg PERSON, my LOI and a real fillip when I solved it and thus completed the grid), to obscure answers clued by easy wordplay, where one is left saying “is that really a word?”.

    Apart from the unknown HOLI, I thought this was fair but very tough, and I took 21:59, one of my slowest completions of the year. I did not know the “other” meaning of ALTER EGO, and struggled to parse POSTMARK (mark = influence?). But eventually all green.

    Many thanks Galspray for the blog. I share your view that the Adelaide Oval is a great venue, just not right now if you are an English cricketer …

    1. Thanks Cedric. But just think, when HOLI comes up again, as it inevitably will, you’ll be grateful to Jalna for having introduced you to it via some simple wordplay.

      See you in Sydney?

      1. Indeed I hope so. 5th test will be a real nailbiter – everything, or at least a 5-0, on the line. Well, they have to have something to play for, even if it is avoiding the tag of “worst touring side since the last one”.

    2. mark=influence … I went with “if you make your mark on history” which suggests you influence subsequent events

    3. Well, seeing as you ask, I wasn’t faced with H?L?. HOLI was a clue I’d already written and was one of the words I used to seed the gridfill with. I don’t personally consider it to be an “obscure” word. Nor I’m sure do the millions of people who celebrate it around the world.

      Others may not share this view I know, but IMO, simple(r) wordplay for a short, potentially lesser-known/used word that might be new/might educate > clever wordplay for a dull word like HELP/HILL, etc. And I often try to apply that thinking regardless of what the crossword is or where it’s being published.

      1. Thank you Jalna for taking the time to come here and explain. As you say, on the question of “simple wordplay, lesser-known answer” versus “complex wordplay, straightforward answer”, preferences will no doubt differ. On this one I was not alone in not knowing Holi, and I’m not entirely comfortable with putting in an answer with fingers crossed that it is actually a real word – but, provided I remember it, I will know it next time.

  18. Found this really tough. Biffed GUTTER as was fixed on making the second part connected with GUT for middle. LOI PERSON.

  19. 23:06 for the solve – my word that was a trauma!

    Experience tells me this is a difficult grid with so many missing starter letters and so it was. My last four were CRATES, DATE, GROT, and POSTMARK – each of which is independent of the others. Didn’t make it easy for myself but thought there were some tough word choices (AGLITTER, HARROW, CRATES, IN-TOTO) mixed in with not-so-helpful clueing.

    Thanks to Galspray and Jalna. Off to run some laps in the sun.

  20. Problems in the SW, as well as other places, eg OBITUARY, bur perseverance paid off and all completed and parsed in the end. FOI DATE, LOI ROOK, COD POSTMARK, but all excellent clues. Thanks, Galspray and Jalna.

  21. Well and truly beaten by Jalna today with DATE, PERSON and SWAP unsolved after 40 minutes. Tough for a QC and I see the Snitch is a bright red 164.
    I did like a lot of the clues though and AGLITTER was my COD as it was satisfying to work out the parsing.
    Thanks to Jalna and Galspay. Enjoy the cricket

  22. Disaster. DNF despite help. Failed on OBIT and BRAN, and needed help with e.g. PERSON and CRATES.
    Thanks vm for much needed blog, Galspray.

  23. Having found a quiet half hour after a village brunch I’m now really cross with myself for attempting to shoehorn a solve into a tiny time frame earlier, and then compounding the sin by glancing at the blog. Why didn’t I just walk away? This was, to me, a really lovely puzzle probably on a par with an easier 15×15 in terms of difficulty. Would I have solved it? Probably but would have been well into the SCC.

    Further note to self: Don’t be so impatient!

  24. I thought that was pretty hard – and the QUITCH is currently running at 154, which is the second highest on record and within comfortable touching distance of the record 160 set by Shay the Merciless.

    For me the struggles were with SWAP (where I could see exactly how it worked but took ages to come up with “paws”) and LOI PERSON (where right up until solving it I hadn’t got a clue how it worked! – “per” for “a” gets me every time). Those two accounted for over three minutes of my 10:37.

    I really enjoyed AGLITTER, a super clue and COD from me.

    Many thanks Jalna and Smuggypants Galspray. I’m going to go and put my DVD of the 2010-11 Ashes on and pretend it’s live.

    1. I’m a little surprised by how high the Quitch is; I didn’t think it was that hard. I’m sure there have been other puzzles I’ve struggled on more

        1. QUITCH doesn’t count non finishers. So a hard puzzle that people eventually complete will have a higher QUITCH than an easy one with one unsolvable clue.

          1. Hard puzzles can have lower SNITCH scores because only the better solvers finish them (and these solvers are less informed by difficulty than the mortals). It’s probably the biggest challenge with the SNITCH, it takes a biased sample of people who found the puzzle easier (by being able to finish it, and finishing inside the top 100 times).

  25. I also found this tough. Is anyone else having issues when solving on the Crossword Club in the Classic app? I keep losing the clues and can only get them back by swiping into the normal puzzles and then back into the CC.

  26. 12:50

    Well, I’m relieved to find that I am not the only one that found this much harder than Galspray suggests in his opening comments. Quitch currently at 143. I guess if you got 18a quickly enough, then the SW corner was a doddle – I didn’t. My LOI was HARROW, already having HOLI in place for some while.

    Thanks G and J

  27. Cheated by revealing second letter of LOI SWAP, then needed blog to explain parsing to boot (thanks galspray). I found this very tricky and it took a lot of perseverance (to DNF 😁). Held up by OBITUARY, CRATES (?) and ROOK. COD TIER (very nice). Many thanks Jalna – tough!

  28. It’s always nice to end the week with an easy one. . . Alternatively, there is some satisfaction to be had in finishing a slog with a pdm, when I finally remembered the a/Per trick to get loi Person.
    I had a plausible Rots (Rot + [i]s) at 11ac before Grandma turned up, but that was the only one I had to change in a steady, albeit very slow, 40min solve.
    Ticks against Obituary, Crates, Gutter and CoD Turnpike indicate that it wasn’t all hard work, but I don’t think I’ll be contributing to Jalna’s return ticket 😉 Invariant

  29. Enjoyed this, helped by being used to A = PER by now. Slowed somewhat by a first entry of CROCKS at 18a (though somewhat troubled by ‘rocks’ not exactly fitting ‘has a favourable opinion of’) which led to quite a bit of puzzled staring at 16d before having a rethink. All done in 11:32. Thanks, Jalna and Galspray.

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