24469

Solving time: 18:32

Solved late at night as I have to be away early tomorrow. Slowish start, and then had four left after 11:30 or so, in the dreaded “2 cross 2” formation – 18, 28, 15D, 14. I made things worse by inventing a new mistake – trying to solve 29 a second time and fit the new answer in at 28 – this might have cost a minute or two. When I read the right clue I think this was the first of the four to fall, once I’d given up on Wallis as “Mrs Simpson”. I suspect some people solving at more sensible times of day will beat my time. Six double defs is quite a few but I don’t mind – there’s no compelling reason why we shouldn’t sometimes have more of a clue type than usual.

Across
1 JUSTIN / JUST IN – 2 defs
4 ATLA(st.),NTIS = isnt*
10 (p)LAN(e),TERN
11 ANTONY,M – a triumvir is a member of a triumvirate
12 YA(N)K – wordplay structure seen long before finding the right animal – rather poor solving, as “statesman” is usually easy to see through
13 NAILED DOWN = (and old wine)*
15 Deliberately omitted – ask if baffled
16 DUB=name,A,I=current (physics notation)
18 AL(ON)G – “alg” being the midst of “sociAL Group”
19 LIFE CLASS – 2 defs – Linnaeus was the father of modern taxonomy
21 PROVERBIAL = (boar, viper, L=left)* – I don’t know the particular proverb which is apparently referred to, about a poor cat
23 I’D = I would,(p)L(a)Y
26 IN,STILL – implant (vb.) is the def.
27 C=carbon, APE=copy, LLA = rev. of all = quite
28 TELEGRAM = rev. of (Marge (Simpson),L/E/T from first letters)
29 C(RAY)ON
 
Down
1 JOLLY – 2 defs
2 S(AN ANGEL)O – the 28th largest city in Texas
3 ITEM – 2 defs
5 TRAILER – 2 defs
6 AUTO,DID ACT = was effective
7 TONDO – hidden – a round painting
8 SE = London area,M(ayhem),ANTICS
9 IN(FAN),T
14 STAGGERING – 2 defs
15 SEAL=swimmer,POINT = direct = train – here’s a Sealpoint Siamese
17 BEARD’S,LEY = (type of) line. Vandyke is one of the various beards used in puzzles – a word worth looking up in Bradford.
19 LOB=send up,ELIA=essayist (C Lamb’s pseudonym)
20 FRAN(C)K – here is the required piece of Cesar Franck that everyone knows
22 O(USE),L
24 Y((chil)E)ARN
25 SPAR(e)

32 comments on “24469”

  1. Jacked this one in after an hour with half left to solve. I blame the United-West Ham match, which I got up at an ungodly hour to watch.

    Google is our friend adage-wise:

    “In Macbeth I, vii, Shakespeare has Lady Macbeth refer to a contemporary adage, when she says,

    Wouldst thou have that
    Which thou esteem’st the ornament of life,
    And live a coward in thine own esteem,
    Letting ‘I dare not’ wait upon ‘I would,’
    Like the poor cat i’ the adage?

    This is reportedly a reference to the Proverbs (1566) of John Heywood — a fellow playwright — which included the following adage that Lady Macbeth thought suited to her husband:

    • “The cat would eate fishe, but would not wet her feete”

    This adage suggests that it is a foolish stance to wish for something but be unwilling to go to some inconvenience to attain our goal.’

    Like me wishing to be able to finish the crossword two days in a row, I suppose …

  2. As a finisher even later at night, got stuck between the only 2 possibles for 18, among and along, and couldn’t make either fit the cluing (though I do see Peter’s parsing). I’m still not sure of “on” as a definition of “along”, even having looked it up in Chambers! Other than that, worked round anticlockwise from NW fairly steadily. Though the cluing made “proverbial” easy enough to work out, I wanted it to be more related to the indecisive cat in particular rather than adages in general. No major smiles for me in this one, but I liked 13.
  3. 19:34 .. a long time at the end to get FRANCK, then LIFE CLASS then finally BEARDSLEY (without having any idea how to explain the latter – it just fit!).

    Really clever stuff. Loved LANTERN, JUSTIN and the similarly conceived INSTILL.

  4. Well, I hope this one satisfies Our Man in Dorset. I came to the end of my allotted lunch hour with three left to do, but then wasn’t able to use aids in case jerry was watching. Got BEARDSLEY fairly quickly (yes, one of the great artists of the last 20 years, but the setter probably had a different Beardsley in mind), making a mental note to consider ‘LEY’ as well as ‘L’ and ‘RY’ when next I see ‘line’.

    Much, much later, SEALPOINT came to mind, before I fell at the last with AMONG instead of ALONG. A tricky puzzle – I’d give it high marks for technical difficulty, but a lower score for artistic impression.

  5. Having spent over the hour while trying to swot for a tutorial on Roland Barthes, I decided 8dn should be extended to 11 letters: “semidiotics” just about describes my morning! Had lots of pop culture fun working out 28 — which made it all worthwhile in the end. Anyone else going to admit to getting stuck in the top left, with the 1ac/1dn/3dn intersections requiring both of the two-word dds?
  6. Regards all. Late night here in NY as well, and this took about 40 minutes. Thanks to ulaca for the fine citation re the proverbial cat, which I didn’t know. Quite impressive for you to pull that out. In addition I didn’t know the SEALPOINT cat, where I thought this referred to plumbing – ‘siamese connection’ in the US is a “Y” joint used in fire suppression/sprinkler systems -, Linnaeus’s specialty, and ‘ley’. SAN ANGELO is an obscure place, even for a US solver, so thanks setter for the readily deciphered cryptic there. Nice puzzle. Best to everyone.
  7. Surprised to have beaten Peter by about eight minutes. SEALPOINT went in without full understanding, but the last ones for me were SEMANTICS giving ANTONYM, not ANTONIO, and LIFE CLASS.
  8. After and extremely shaky start I was very surprised to finish this in 35 minutes in three sessions and without resort to aids. There were far too many obscure references for my liking so those answers went in, deduced either from wordplay or defintion but not fully unexplained. My last in was 18 where I first wrote AMONG and then changed to ALONG without being 100% convinced until I spotted the hidden container. Have we had this sort of clue before?
  9. Glad it wasn’t just me. I went over the hour before giving up and guessing SHADPOINT and ALONG. One out of two isn’t bad; although SEALPOINT was the word I was trying to think of. Thought the ALG could be the Adult Learning Group (where do I sign up?) or the Alzheimer’s Liaison Group (ditto). And another who hastily penned SEMIOTICS at 8, before realising it was short an id. (Too many egos?) I very much liked MARGE at 28 (having also tried for too long to shoehorn Wallis in) but COD to ANTONYM.
  10. Satisfied customer today. 20m and enjoyed a number of pleasing “aha!” moments, especially getting the C21st Mrs.S, Antony and the elegant pussy. Worked from left to right, first in lantern, last in 11 & 14. Rather literary gk today which suits me. For me instil usually has one l and that was the first alternative offered when I dic-checked after finishing.
  11. Ah! The divine Renee. Good YouTube choice Peter. You could have had Charlotte Church, but then couldn’t we all. Yes Mc, NW last to fall and JUSTIN LASTIN (even though possibly the easiest clue. That’s because it took so long to see JOLLY which gets my COD for its concision. Very hard, chuffed to finish at all, unashamed help all over the place. Hats off to those finishing aidless.
  12. 15:50 on the train this morning. A very slow start, but sped up eventually. I found a lot of the clues impenetrable at first look, but with a couple of checking letters they became obvious. Held up by wanting 1D to be LIGHT, trying to fit WALLIS reversed into 28, thinking the anagram of (boar viper l) would end in -ABLE (and not getting the reference, thanks ulaca). Top left corner was the last to go in, JUSTIN, JOLLY and YANK in that order.
  13. Yes, a very nice one today. First in AUTODIDACT, last ITEM – yes McText, those last 3 held me up at the end.

    At 28, I remember a few months ago trying to fit WALLIS into an answer, before tumbling that it was the other – much more crossword-friendly – Mrs S who was required. That was useful today.

    At 29ac did anyone else try to convince themself that DE(TAI)N might mean “draw” ? – it had me wondering for a while.

  14. Nicely blogged Peter. I’d have got nowhere trying to solve this one at midnight.

    I came up three short today, missing SEALPOINT, BEARDSLEY and ALONG. I’d thought of ALONG but couldn’t justify it. Hadn’t heard of Vandyke beards or the artist so would never have got him. Much else to enjoy though and I was pleased to work out many answers from the wordplay, e.g. LANTERN, SAN ANGELO, CRAYON, CAPELLA, TONDO and FRANCK. TELEGRAM was first in – we’ve seen MARGE for Mrs Simpson within the past year.

  15. Clearly a much better puzzle than yesterday and one I would have enjoyed blogging. 25 minutes to solve but I agree with both richnorth and z8… that it’s higher on technical merit than artistic impression.

    18A ALONG is interesting, drawing “alg” from two different words. 21A PROVERBIAL is a bit 1960s – the quote was certainly lost on me. 2D SAN ANGELO must be classed as obscure. Luckily “angel” for financial backer is a knee jerk substitution. Once you’ve met the cat before it’s no problem but is difficult the first time. The same goes for the beard and I don’t know who BEARDSLEY was.

    I loved 28A TELEGRAM, excellent construction and nicely misleading

    1. Kurihan’s image today is an example of his work. Very well-known illustrator (if you collect illustrated books).
  16. There were lots of obscurities here so I was pleased to finish even though it took me two sessions. Fortunately, some of the trickier clues had a familiar ring. Antonym is usually clued as something like “Friend of Caesar J, or the opposite?” to make the Antony M more clear. Like Daniel, when I see Mrs Simpson and Edward in a clue these days I automatically go for Marge.

    I finished with Along and Sealpoint. As Z8etc says, there does not seem to be any justification for along = on in Chambers. Collins (4) has “The horse trotted along at a steady pace”, which might just pass the substitution test.

    Finally I racked my brains for synonyms of Siamese. I got Thai, conjoined and cat but it was some time before I made the further conceptual leap to Sealpoint.

    1. I quite like “z8etc”. I’ve not been on this board long, and would have been the much easier Zabadak if someone else hadn’t beaten me to it. Apparently Zabadak is a wildly successful Japanese band, but for me will always be Dave Dee Dozy Beaky Mick and Titch’s 1967 “bet we can’t have a hit with a song with made up words” opus.
      1. Sorry I was too dim to spot the ‘8’ for ‘a‘ substitution. Zabadak. It was one of my favourites in 1967, the year the music died. I did not realise the lyrics were meaningless. I always thought the verse was “Meet me on the Barbican site we can have a fight”. I think that was a prominent industrial dispute at the time. Dave Dee made a sad but dignified exit recently. People of his, and our, vintage should probably follow his advice and get a PSA test.
        1. Thanks – did not know Dave Dee had joined the choir invisible. I saw DDBM&T a four years back at a revival gig in St Albans, where Dave described the genesis of Zabadak in something very similar to the words I used. Of course there were (real) words too, but I don’t think I ever knew what they were until I looked them up this morning. At the concert, every 50 something was merrily singing the zabadak bit, but leaving the real words to the boys.
          And yes, I’ve had my PDA.
  17. pleased to finish without aids, though “sealpoint” was a guess and my last in after “along”. a long solve but i never felt totally at sea as i sometimes do. maybe i was lucky knowing the vocab except for our siamese friend.
  18. As my solving progressed I thought this certainly tougher than yesterday’s but I expected to finish in about 40 minutes. Not so. After 45 minutes I was left with 8d, 15d and 17d. I entered SEALPOINT very tentatively, toying with SHADPOINT like kororeka. Unfortunately I’d entered LIFE CYCLE for 19a, which screwed up my chances of getting 8 and 17. In the end I had to use aids to clean up the mess.

    As has been observed, a far better puzzle than yesterday’s. I particularly liked the clues to 11 and 12.

  19. Peter B, 18 minutes????
    Going by the 3 times rule, I should have done this in 54 minutes BUT I finished this in just a little under 30 minutes. So, am I improving or is Peter B having a bad day?

  20. Just over 20 minutes, after a delay caused by also putting in SEMIOTICS without thinking the clue through.

    Perhaps it’s literary heresy, but every time I see it these days I can’t help but think that the use of essayist=Elia is past its best before date, especially in a puzzle where Mrs Simpson is Marge.

  21. Oddly I found this one easy. I had some time to kill before a meeting last night (in California) so I went to Starbucks and did the whole thing in about 25 minutes without really getting held up on anything. Rare for me to be close to PB’s time whatever time of day he is solving. My mother had a sealpoint siamese when I was a kid so that went straight in. And I switchd from Wallis to Marge very quickly.
  22. From one extreme to the other. After being pleased with yesterday’s quick solve, I got my comeuppance today.

    Half of it, mainly the bit below the SW-NE diagonal went in well, but then I ground to a halt for a long time and finally resorted to aids after an hour and a couple SEALPOINT and AUTODIDACTIC kick started the rest. It also didn’t help that I had invented the Texas town of L[OA]S ANGELO

    SEALPOINT I don’t think I would have got in a month of Sundays. The rest I should have got.

  23. One hour dead on in three gos. Pleased to guess ‘sealpoint’ correctly. Not too bad for me given the difficulty of the puzzle I felt. Last in ‘beardsley’ and ‘capella’ where I was trying to fit ‘cc’ in somewhere for ages. Well done to the setter.
  24. Relatively straighforward. Solving time of 41′.

    The degree of moderate difficulty included the clunky ‘train’ for ‘point’ in SEALPOINT.. Other than that 10ac, 13ac and 28ac.

    Too mant DD’s though.

  25. I had no problem with this. Must have been because of:

    ‘That is the problem which is torturing me, Jeeves. I can’t make up my
    mind. You remember the fellow you’ve mentioned to me once or twice, who
    let something wait upon something? You know who I mean — the cat chap.’

    ‘Macbeth, sir, a character in a play of that name by the late William
    Shakespeare. He was described as letting “I dare not” wait upon “I
    would”, like the poor cat i’ th’ adage.’

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