15ac 17ac with Frank Bough…

…who I guess is fair game for inclusion in Times puzzles now, having passed away last week. RIP!

FOI 13ac, LOI 10ac. Very hard indeed I thought, and fatigue must have set in as I managed to submit with RADETSKY instead of RADETZKY, even though I’d worked out how it all worked. Solidarity with those who grumble about foreign names clued by anagrams (“how was I supposed to choose between RADETZKY and REDATZKY?”) perhaps.

COD to the somewhat madcap 19dn, though 15ac also gets points. For a while I thought “pop” referred to “granddad” and considered the clue a little risque! A very good workout all in all, so thanks to the setter. Let’s hope that all three puzzles in the imminent Online Championships are at least as hard as this one, to make things challenging! At 2.30 in the morning my time, groan…

ACROSS
1 Tips from writer with daughter in America (6)
UPENDS – PEN [writer] with D(aughter) in US

5 Say nothing about preference for nagging (8)
SHREWISH – SH RE WISH [say nothing! | about | preference]

9 Weakness that’s not hard to see (4,4)
SOFT SPOT – SOFT [not hard] + SPOT [to see]

10 Being out of place in harbour, finally sailor returned (6)
STUPOR – PUT in {harbou}R + O(rdinary) S(eaman), the whole reversed

11 Transport add-on, one given to appropriate vehicles? (8)
JOYRIDER – JOY [transport] + RIDER [add-on]. “Appropriate” as in “steal”.

12 Reverses and runs down (6)
KNOCKS – double def, in the senses of “misfortunes’ and “disparages”

13 Aussie skipper adding a run to total in chase (8)
WALLAROO – add A R(un) to ALL [total], and put that in WOO [chase]

15 She had pop award reduced (4)
GRAN – GRAN{t}. She had pop, as in, she gave birth to dad.

17 Boy back in detention at school (4)
STAN – hidden reversed in {detention}N AT S{school}

19 Hiding, maybe, in service area (8)
MASSACRE – MASS ACRE [service | area]

20 Moon, mostly, keeps spinning around in space (6)
LACUNA – I think “moon, mostly” is LUNA{r}, thinking of “moon” as a loose adjective as in “moon lander”; though it seems to me that LUNA could just be “moon”, without qualification. In any case! LUNA{r} must keep reversed C(irc)A [“spinning” around]

21 Dispatching letters from UN, a minor foreign correspondent? (3,3,2)
OUR MAN IN – (UN A MINOR*)

22 Lose track of exceptionally fine port (6)
VENICE – take VERY NICE [exceptionally fine], and lose its R(ailwa)Y “track”

23 Revelation in tweet set back husband — and then some! (8)
EPIPHANY – reversed PIPE [tweet] + H(usband) + ANY [some]

24 Austrian count’s last letter, dark, yet animated (8)
RADETZKY – (Z + DARK YET*)

25 Boring article, on golf, they’ve permitted me (6)
GIMLET – on G(olf}, I’M LET [they have permitted me]

DOWN
2 One supplying plug for engine you can pick up? (8)
PROMOTER – PRO [for] + homophone of MOTOR [engine]

3 Rubbish won’t burn in the shade (8)
NUTBROWN – (WON’T BURN*)

4 Raised a large cover over father’s tree (9)
SAPODILLA – reverse all of A L(arge) LID [cover] O(ver) PA’S [father’s]

5 Earmark hypermarket, perhaps, to give huge value (3,5,5,2)
SET GREAT STORE BY – if you earmark something you SET it BY, and a hypermarket is a GREAT STORE

6 Use a lot of each colour filling in box (3,4)
EAT INTO – EA(ch) + TINT [colour] + {b}O{x} [the “filling” of the word BOX]

7 Home, compact in size, for the richer (2,6)
IN POCKET – IN [home] + POCKET [compact in size, as in Peter’s Pocket Grandpa]

8 Chap managed to collect medal for serving livestock owner (8)
HERDSMAN – HE RAN [chap | managed], “collecting” D(istinguished) S(ervice) M(edal)

14 Fido at last caught, dog collar is going on (9)
OCCURRING – {fid}O + C(aught) + CUR [dog] + RING [collar]

15 Person who offers to hold case for cockney traveller (8)
GULLIVER – GIVER [person who offers], “holding” ‘ULL [case, unaspirated]

16 Maybe tick playing card in a hand, initially (8)
ARACHNID – (CARD IN A H{and}*)

17 Outside right, cunningly, apes the fellow top wingers (8)
SERAPHIM – outside R(ight), (APES*) + HIM

18 Union spent to bring in a civil engineer (8)
ALLIANCE – ALL IN [spent], “bringing in” A, + C(ivil) E(ngineer)

19 Peel the source of this pus? (4,3)
MANX CAT – so Peel is a seaside town on the Isle of Man, where you could presumably find a PUS{s} – a cat without a tail, for which the IOM is so very famous.

56 comments on “15ac 17ac with Frank Bough…”

  1. Just inside my target time of 107 minutes. When you get 1 Across right away, you know you’re in for a tough time.

    I had the right idea for pretty much all of the wordplay, I just couldn’t come up with the right pieces. My last two were KNOCKS, which felt like a flimsy guess — and STUPOR, which seemed like it was the only word that fit, and sort of fit the definition, but I was having a bear of a time with the wordplay. Turns out I’d forgotten the handy O.S. abbreviation, which I do have kicking around in there. (D.S.M., I didn’t.) Thanks to Verlaine for setting me straight on my STUPOR.

    I never really take or let myself take more than an hour these days on a puzzle, but this one felt like a matter of pride.

    EDIT: Holy moly I just got the subtlety of MANX CAT. Thanks, V!

    Edited at 2020-10-30 02:19 am (UTC)

  2. I thought I did well to finish this all correct. I got stuck towards the end with MANX CAT, GULLIVER, and VENICE. They are all fair when you see them, but not the sort of words you can reverse engineer from the wordplay. My LOI was STUPOR since I couldn’t see how it worked and wondered if there was another word that fitted that I was being blind to. I checked after submitting and that’s the only word. I’m not sure “stupor” and “being out” are quite equivalent. “in a stupor”, sure.
    1. Isn’t it the gerund? State of stupor, state of being out? Something like that. This comes up fairly often and gets me every time.
      1. We did those in the fifth form and like logarithms, hockey and Plath, I never went back.
  3. I nodded off towards the end, but took well over an hour before everything was in correctly. I spent about half the time up in the NE corner with KNOCKS, STUPOR and IN POCKET being particularly slow to yield their secrets. Thanks to Johann Strauss for RADETZKY and to previous crosswords for GIMLET and SAPODILLA.

    Difficult but worth the time spent. The ‘top wingers’ def and surface for MANX CAT were my picks.

    Thanks to setter and blogger

  4. Less than half completed after an hour at which point I retired for the night. On resumption this morning I had a very productive 15 minutes in which I managed to enter all but five answers in the bottom half, but then I was stuck for another 15 minutes and decided to use aids to get things moving again.

    The first I looked up was EPIPHANY as the only outstanding answer in the SE quarter. I should have got this one and was annoyed that I didn’t.

    My next cheat was MANX CAT as I knew I was never going to work it out from wordplay. It hinged on knowing PEEL as a place on the I.O.M. which I didn’t, ‘Douglas’ being the only town there that I have heard of. After spending so much time thinking about ‘pus’ this morning I’m not sure I want any breakfast!

    My final cheat was VENICE after which the other two missing answers, GULLIVER and LACUNA fell into place.

    Like our blogger I errored on the Austrian count, but on the basis that ‘count’s last letter’ was S. I’ve seen the name so many times in the title of Strauss the elder’s ‘Radetzky March’ I really ought to have got it right.

  5. Glad I gave up with plenty left after an hour, as the option I had pencilled in for 24a was indeed REDATSKY, which would have been annoying if I’d ever managed to work out the rest. Found this a pain from start to DNF…
  6. …Their loud uplifted angel trumpets blow.
    After 35 mins I decided to give up on the last several.
    My difficulties were the In Pocket/Knocks crossers and the whole Gulliver, Manx Cat, Lacuna, Venice group.
    Excellently chewy. Thanks setter and V.
  7. Defeated by NE and SW, got RADETZKY, should have got GULLIVER. Agree ‘mostly’ is redundant. COD to MANX CAT, also unsolved.

    Thanks verlaine and setter.

  8. 51 minutes. LOI STUPOR. RADETSKY came through his march in an EPIPHANY. COD to MANX CAT. I liked JOY RIDER and GRAN too. And OUR MAN IN was good, if seeming like unfinished business for Graham Greene. I recall one afternoon on Grandstand when a Franco Boffi was running for Italy at an international athletics event. It was a shame and unnecessary that we lost Frank from the mainstream. We can be a horribly priggish nation. Hard but fair puzzle. Thank you V and setter.
  9. 43:37. Crikey, that was hard. The toughest for a long time. I came close to giving up a couple of times but soldiered on.
    I knew RADETZKY from his march, but he deserved unambiguous wordplay if you ask me. Otherwise this was mostly a case of everyday words clued with extremely devious wordplay. That’s usually my favourite kind of puzzle but this was a case of exquisite torture.
    I’d love to know who the setter is: whoever you are, thanks you b******.

    Edited at 2020-10-30 10:28 am (UTC)

    1. I’d guess John Henderson. I struggle mightily with his puzzles and I was nowhere near finishing this one.

        1. I hope you’re wrong. I can’t bear the thought that there are two setters out there who have me stumped.
  10. DNF. I had about two thirds done in about 20 minutes but then got stuck. I had PUT GREAT STORE ON for 5D which crippled me for the NE and SW corners until I sorted it. I never did parse VENICE, GRAN and STUPOR (my LOI) and then I found I had 2 wrong with PROCURER and OUTRIDER for 1D and 11A, which I forgot to come back to. Grr. Lots to enjoy, thought t=when the pennies slowly drifted down. MANX CAT my favourite. Thanks for the explanations V, and thanks to setter for the stern test. You got me beat today. P.S. I don’t feel quite so bad when I see only 22 all correct in the stats… and 2 of those are neutrinos.

    Edited at 2020-10-30 09:47 am (UTC)

    1. Well I did finish in 40:50 – but I had 4 errors!

      Corridor, Undoes, In profit and Radetsky.

      Tough!

      COD: Mass Acre

      1. My two wrong were also UNDOES and IN PROFIT (after an hour or more I was clearly going for words that fitted the grid and odd bits of the definition rather than actually solving the clues). Not good.

        Liked MANX CAT and GULLIVER although it took an age to get them.

    2. . . .That there are only 22 correct in the stats. It means that the crossword was effectively directed at a tiny, tiny minority of solvers. It was far harder than a mephisto. I’ve won a prize in the latter, but I had no chance with this. There’s a place for this type of crossword, but not in the daily, since no beginner or intermediate had a remote hope of solving it. Including me. Perhaps the weekend Times2 might be the ideal, as an additional offering. I gave up after 5 minutes, because I could see where this one was going quite early on. Mr Grumpy
  11. Abandoned ship on the half hour with KNOCKS missing thanks to biffing IN PROFIT. All would have been in vain in any case as I typed in RADETSKY despite not only knowing the piece but owning a transcription for organ that I never did manage to master. On today’s evidence I suggest a RACK of setters would be an appropriate collective noun.
  12. Firm but fair, struggled with STUPOR and KNOCKS (it wasn’t ‘undoes’) but got there in the end. I wrote ‘Ve(ry)nice’ on my postcards from VENICE, so I saw that one straight away. Completed in record time, personal worst.
  13. You can’t ignore punctuation here: it’s the last letter of count. I don’t think you’d ever see ‘count last letter’ to indicate T in the Times.
    1. Of course. In my first post I was describing my (flawed) train of thought in the heat of solving. In my second I was being flippant in the face of an anon pointing out the b*****n’ obvious.

      Edited at 2020-10-30 01:47 pm (UTC)

      1. Where’s Kevin when we need him!?
        Neither flippancy or sarcasm are tolerated nor understood in these parts, as I was recently informed by the ‘rhotic’ Mr. Riddlecombe.
  14. You know you’ve got a toughie when (at the time of writing) your 42.31 is way up there at 17th. Same tricky area as everyone else, I think: NE and SW. There are some very oblique bits of wordplay: (h)ull from case, for example, which needs a 3 point turn in a thesaurus.
    VENICE obviously IS a port, but that’s not really how most people think of it, and the wordplay was brutal.
    MANX CAT is brilliant verging on the desperately unfair: for a long time I thought “Peel the source of this” hinted at MET, and the definition (pus!) being itself a defective word didn’t help much.
    Very, very hard without any MCS words to speak of, a considerable achievement by the setter. If Championship puzzles hit this level, some of us will find it very hard to resist the temptation to “accidentally” let the dictionary fall open a few times.

    Edited at 2020-10-30 10:34 am (UTC)

  15. What a toughie! And it beat me – after 25m 25s I thought I’d finally cracked the NE corner with IN PROFIT & UNDOES (neither of which I could quite justify, of course), but that was far from my only struggle. Some delightfully chewy wordplay, thanks setter.

    I’d never heard of Peel so I’d thought we were looking for something relating to the Bow Street Runners – that SW corner also took an age, but getting GULLIVER helped the others to fall.

  16. After 10 minutes looking at a blank grid I admonished self to treat this like a really hard TLS puzzle – a Broteas (aka P. Biddlecombe) brute – and get cracking. The only one I still wonder about is the MASSACRE definition in 19a. I thought a “hiding” was six of the best from the head beak when you’d been caught smoking behind the changing rooms. We’ve got snow on the ground here this morning – not much but it makes me very glad we voted on Monday. 44.41
    1. Hiding/massacre can both mean a severe defeat (see Lexico definitions).

      Edited at 2020-10-30 12:46 pm (UTC)

  17. Well, for the first time in a while, I definitely had that Friday feeling. In this case, a feeling of some satisfcation at finishing this off at all. Very tough, very enjoyable. Finished by reversing my UNDOES, with which I was never 100% confident, and suddenly seeing POCKET as a result. Thought 15ac the best of many candidates for COD.
  18. Nope, nay, noway was I going to finish this, just to end a dismal week. And now we’re in le « confinement » again! Stuck, as others, in the NE and SE and gave up after what seemed like an eternity. It’s annoying, because it’s not a question of not knowing the words , except for SAPODILLA, and EPIPHANY always make me think of Love Actually ( I know V, you hate it! ), but not being able to fathom them out from the wordplay. Too clever for me. Thanks V for the answers and explanations.
  19. 9 left after 60 mins.

    Didn’t get SHREWISH, STUPOR, KNOCKS, IN POCKET (though pencilled in the first word) – guess if this had gone in then 10a and 12a would have been guessable?

    In the bottom left, had both GRAN and RADETZKY but nothing between.

    At least I learnt a new word (LACUNA) and that a tick is an arachnid – every day’s a school day.

  20. I certainly needed the blog today so many thanks to V.
    After 37 minutes, I just couldn’t get GULLIVER, VENICE or MANX CAT – that tricky SW corner.
    I also biffed KNOCKS (I didn’t know the ‘reverses’ connection) and STUPOR (very tough clue) although I did manage to guess SAPODILLA and ARACHNID from the definition.
    Amongst my favourites were PROMOTER, SET GREAT STORE BY and OCCURRING – and my COD has to be MANX CAT now that I understand it.
    Thanks to the setter for the challenge even though I didn’t rise to it!
  21. At least the QC and concise were reasonably easy. Needed the excellent blog to explain everything. MANX CAT outstanding. Got over half in 30 mins without the need of aids, after that well…. I submitted without leaderboard. I must admit I enjoyed all of the 120 mins I spent on this, thanks setter, just don’t rush back too soon.
    1. Mr. Row, you are certainly not on your own! But I did like Emma Peel. Never been to the IOM – IOW is magic.
  22. Yes I thought it was a misprint until I got the Peel connection. Really not sure if a HULL is a case, for a long time i was working with CY as the case for cockney.
    Liked ARACHNID and GRAN.
  23. I took GRAMMYS and reduced it to reveal GRAN,as half an ‘M’ is a ‘N” typographically speaking. Little logic but it gave me 15dn GULLIVER.

    But wasn’t so lucky elsewhere. This has to be tough as Kevin is absent. Meldrew DNF with bar and Oak Leaves.

    FOI 17ac STAN (Laurel?)

    COD not 19dn MANX CAT yuk! but 24ac REDATSKY which eluded me.

    WOD 5ac PRIGGISH

    When it come to ARACHNIDS – I’m with Little Miss Muffet

    Edited at 2020-10-30 04:41 pm (UTC)

  24. And they finally did, except for joyrider where I’d tentatively bunged in corridor intending to revisit, and on apparently completing after an hour and more with the tailless one last to sneak in, forgot to do so. Annoying after all that but an achingly good puzzle. Strewth.
  25. ….and now I’ve seen the blog it was a wise decision. Great puzzle, but I only did two thirds of it in 23 minutes.
  26. Annoyed not to finish this, ran out of time with LACUNA, VENICE and MANX CAT remaining in the SW corner. I lived in the Isle of Man for nearly 20 years so should have twigged the Peel connection. Cunning use of it as the first word so not obviously a Capitalised word version of peel.
    Well blogged V, glad it was not my turn today.
    A MER for IN POCKET, I know OUT OF but never heard that.
  27. DNF. Toiled away for about an hour at lunch and another half hour after work but finally gave up with Manx cat and Venice unsolved. A bruising encounter with a very hard puzzle.
  28. Late on parade today.. been out, doing things that were no help at all when it came to tackling this monster. Got there in the end though, I’m pleased to say.
    Peel is an altogether lovely seaside town, or was when i spent two holidays there back in the 1960s. I remember that the water in the harbour was so clear you could see the fish swimming about, thirty feet down. I wonder if it still is.
  29. I thought I’d compose this quick letter
    To express sincere thanks to the setter
    I thought LACUNA was best
    Now my brain needs a rest
    But crosswords can seldom be better
  30. Undone by Knocks and In Pocket, where, like others, UNDOES and IN PROFIT were entered. 81mins of hard graft, and much of it spent in the NE.
  31. An unhelpful grid, which almost falls into four separate puzzles: effectively gave up yesterday, coming back this morning to use aid for suggestions that fit checkers.
    Eventually did fill grid, after realising that 5dn wasn’t SET … ON, so that 24ac could be an anagram (I’d been trying to get TYROLEAN). However, I did find LUCINA for 20ac, who ia moon goddess, so seemed possible.
    Thanks Verlaine for explaining all those I couldn’t parse!

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