Times Quick Cryptic No 1138 by Orpheus

Author   rolytolyPosted on Categories Quick Cryptic
Good puzzle from Orpheus, bad solve from me. I got into a flap at 1ac because I remembered the same clue cropping up recently, but couldn’t for the life of me remember what that damn word for a fake gemstone was. (It was last Tuesday in the 15×15: “National emblem a rhinestone?”) So I was convinced I was looking for a fake gemstone, and the word was edging ever closer to the tip of my tongue the more checkers I had. I mightn’t be the most reliable of witnesses. Perhaps I was ruling out its ending in “-stone”, as that was in the clue, or perhaps I don’t care much for gemstones, and even less for fake ones. Or perhaps my memory’s even crappier than I gave credit. Whatever, I gave up at the 12 minute mark, which was definitely a good decision as I’d bunged in the wrong answer at 4d with “adhere”, and I see there’s only only one word with the checkers: S_A_R_A_.* Elsewhere there were lots of bits and pieces I didn’t know: the game of golf at 8ac, the young pig at 10ac, the port at 12 ac, the party at 13ac, and the boat at 12d. Lots of things to forget, then, but lots of nice clues along the way, so I’ll just give COD to 15d and say many thanks to Orpheus!

*Have a go, answer’s below.

Across
1 National emblem made of imitation stone? (8)
SHAMROCK – I’ll just imitation and rhinestone – sorry, copy and paste – from Jack’s blog last Tuesday: “Alternatively spaced this could be ‘sham rock’ suggesting an artificial gem of which the rhinestone is an example”.
5 In Chester he accommodated a flightless bird (4)
RHEA – in the letters of chesteR HE Accommodated
8 How some golf is played, all day and all night (5,3,5)
ROUND THE CLOCK – double definition: the golf variant involves putting a ball from twelve numbered points in the vague direction of a central hole.
10 Union leader stabs young sow? Shame! (5)
GUILT – U (Union “leader”) stabs/enters GILT (young sow). News to me – meaning that I (probably) haven’t come across it in a crossword in the last week or so.
11 Make coarse gag heard at first in French city (7)
ROUGHEN – G H (Gag Heard, “at first”) in ROUEN (French city)
12 Sweet retired American at port in Indiana (6)
SUGARY – SU (US=American, retired=reversed) GARY (port in Indiana). I can’t be bothered to do too much research on this, but I’m prepared to assert that Elbert Henry Gary is one of the few lawyers who’ve had a US city named after them in the 20th century while they’re still alive. Oh yeah, he was also the founding chairman of US Steel, and the steel mill founded there in 1906 (also named after him) was for many years the largest in the world.
13 A big book about start of Hoover’s party (2-4)
AT-HOME – A TOME (a big book) about H (start of Hoover). An “at-home” is a dated term for a come-and-go-as-you-please type affair.
16 Flight organisers in row after broadcast? (7)
AIRLINE – LINE (row) going after AIR (broadcast)
18 Reportedly studies organ stops (5)
REEDS – READS (studies) is reportedly/sounds the same as the answer.
20 Converted at chapel, Mabel finds top priest’s residence (7,6)
LAMBETH PALACE – Anagram (converted) of AT CHAPEL MABEL. It took me a while to grudgingly accept there was no M or B in either Vatican Palace or Lateran Palace.
21 £25 for small horse (4)
PONY – double definition
22 Experienced person — former athletics official? (3-5)
OLD-TIMER – OLD (former) TIMER (athletics official)
Down
1 Quiet game ultimately inviting noncommittal gesture (5)
SHRUG – Sh (quiet) RU (rugby union = game) G (“ultimately” invitinG)
2 A product of thought? That’s funny (7)
AMUSING – a musing = a product of thought.
3 Again ascertain alien wears brightly-coloured fur (11)
REDETERMINE – ET (alien) wears RED (brightly-coloured) ERMINE (fur)
4 Business woman’s hope finally to stick together (6)
COHERE – CO. (Business) HER (woman’s) E (hopE, finally)
6 Illicit liquor from house overlooking old church (5)
HOOCH – HO. (house) overlooking/above O(ld) CH(urch). Short for “Hoochinoo”, originally a liquor made by and named after a tribe of Alaskan Indians. The OED has a nice quote from 1898: “Whenever whisky runs short the Yukoner falls back upon a villanous decoction known as ‘hootchinoo’, or ‘hootch’.”
7 Obliquely request fighter pilot to conceal name (7)
ASKANCE – ASK (request) ACE (fighter pilot) to conceal/envelop N (name)
9 Equivalent section of bar? (11)
COUNTERPART – part of a counter = bar section
12 Light boat everyone observed in store (7)
SHALLOP – ALL (everyone) observed inside SHOP (store). It can be either a large, heavy gun ship, or a small dinghy.
14 Provide too much weaponry, making such a delivery? (7)
OVERARM – to over arm = to provide too much weaponry; when it’s one word it’s a cricket delivery.
15 All the ground is deadly! (6)
LETHAL – anagram (ground) of ALL THE.
17 Eg Caesar’s Republican state (5)
ROMAN – R(epublican) OMAN (state)
19 Pierce second piece of fruit (5)
SPEAR – S(econd) PEAR (piece of fruit)

Answer: STAIRWAY – I’d say that’s quite tough.

29 comments on “Times Quick Cryptic No 1138 by Orpheus”

  1. DNK ROUND THE CLOCK or the money meaning of PONY, but they weren’t really a problem. I got ASKANCE, but for the wrong reason, taking ‘conceal name’ as a deletion indicator, and wondering who the famous airman Nance was. Vaguely knew ‘gilt’–couldn’t have told you what it meant if asked, but. I liked LETHAL. 5:41, with Vinyl breathing down my neck.
  2. Feared the worst when I didn’t get a single across clue until 20. After that the bottom filled up nicely and then filled in steadily to the top. LOI was reeds, got fixated on dens for studies and didn’t know reed for organ. Good puzzle, some satisfying groans when the penny dropped.
  3. 8 minutes. According to Google, SHALLOP has come up only once before since TftT began, in a 15×15 puzzle in January 2012. I didn’t know it then either, but like today I trusted to wordplay and was rewarded with a correct answer. I also didn’t know GARY at 12ac, but what else could it be? I used to play ‘clock-golf’ in my childhood so 8ac was no problem for me.
    1. Thank goodness! I feared SHALLOP was one of those words that comes up all the time but resolutely fails to stick. It was certainly new to me and a bit naughty for the QC I thought. It cost me some time at the end wondering if I should trust the wordplay.
  4. Sometimes a clue calls up a memory you haven’t torched in years: ROUND THE CLOCK (which I originally put in as ROUND AND ROUND) is one such: my grandmother had a lawn big enough for the game, and I can *feel* the set of twelve metal, spiked, roman numerals to be laid out in a circle. I haven’t thought of that for maybe 55 years, the brain cells have been replace many times over, yet the memory is a lively, vivid thing. How is that even possible? The wonders of the mind!
    This was a straight through solve (though the clue above had to be amended) helped by the memory jog at SHAMROCK: these days short term memory is even more remarkable! SHALLOP not really known and nearly SCALLOP, but close enough to SLOOP to be plausible.
    Thanks roly for all the extra info, on HOOCH(inoo) in particular. It’s good to learn new stuff.
    1. I too thought of the Roman numerals and their metal spikes and I was reminded of the childhood friend who had a garden well-suited for clock-golf as it had a perfectly round and well-maintained lawn. I hadn’t thought of him in years as we parted company when, aged 11, we went on to separate schools and mixed in different circles.

      Edited at 2018-07-19 07:28 am (UTC)

    1. I quite like this game now that I see it, I might try to get a set – and with a modest amount of effort I could get some future archaeologist all frothy-mouthed with the discovery of an important site of neo-pagan sundial-worship!
  6. I was rather surprised about how quickly I solved this (8.39) considering that there were a couple of unknowns in it – 12d and 13a – but I trusted the wordplay and chose not to procrastinate for once.
    Like Roly I initially had ADHERE in for 4d which made LOI 1a a bit tricky. Particularly enjoyed 3d
    Thanks for the blog
  7. The only reason I know Gary, Indiana is the song of the same name from the musical “The Music Man”. Trouble is it’s a really annoying earworm, dammit. I shall probably be hearing this all day now.
    I made rather too heavy weather of this, not helped by bunging in ROUND AND ABOUT for 8a. But despite not knowing SHALLOP or GILT, I just managed to squeak in under my 10 minute target.
  8. Back to a slow time of 33 minutes, but at least half of that spent on roughen, cohere, round the clock and counterpoint. Hadn’t heard of the golf game so was doubting myself, even though it seemed obvious from the definition.

    Dnk gary, reeds for organ stops or the at home party.

    COD guilt.

  9. Milton Jones classic – “when I was in Ireland the audience threw shamrocks at me – unfortunately they were real” – he gives other examples but let’s stay polite:)
  10. Very good puzzle. Like others, I had to go way down the grid (apart from rhea!) before starting to motor slowly. Some ingenious clues and a sense of satisfaction (but no sense of speed) when I finally got back to the NW corner and it all came together. Getting on for 5 kevins….. Thanks to Orpheus and roly. John
  11. My first one went in with a SHRUG and I was off. Like z8 I shoved ROUND AND ROUND in at 8a, but quickly changed it. I thought of ADHERE at 4d but couldn’t parse it and COHERE came quickly to mind. After that the only hold up was my LOI SHALLOP, where I had to trust the wordplay. Nice puzzle. 9:16. Thanks Roly and Orpheus.
  12. Maybe just me but I would be surprised if anyone who has only been at these puzzles for less than 6 months found this remotely easy. I think this was really hard and once again only got about 30% of the answers. I will probably give this another couple of months, but I am fast reaching the conclusion that crosswords are not my thing. It really is too depressing being beaten up each day by a puzzle. Nakrian Kickiat
    1. Don’t give up. It’s taken me 2 years to finish the puzzle most days. I don’t even look at the bloggers’ times. My best ever was 14 minutes. Keep going. It’s addictive fun.
      1. Having cut my teeth on other simpler cryptics (such as the Daily Mail and Daily Telegraph) I approached Times only about 10 years ago, not without some trepidation and was absolutely delighted when I got a single solitary clue!
        I can now generally complete the quickie crossword but only because I can recognize many of the conventions and phrasings (e.g. certain words shout “anagram ahead!” or “hunt the hidden word”) and, of course, sheer doggedness. But there are still occasions when the whole thing seems to defeat me. So, nil desperandum – it get’s easier, promise. Remember there are plenty of people (including me) who think you are a marvel for getting even 30% of the answers.

        Edited at 2018-07-19 11:31 am (UTC)

      2. Thanks, good to know someone else struggles. A bit of a turn off all the 8 minute solvers posting times and sort of feels like it is designed to make one feel stupid. Will keep at it a bit longer
        1. When I started doing the Times cryptic(there was no QC then) just over 7 years ago, the first puzzle I attempted took me 3 days using every aid I could find. After those 3 days I only had 75% of the puzzle complete and have no idea whether any of the answers I put in were actually correct. A few months later I discovered the TfTT Blog and lurked. Eventually I felt able to contribute and was made welcome, but for the first couple of years I was chuffed if I managed to get anywhere near completion in 90 minutes or under. The help I received here, and still receive, is invaluable. Having the constructions of the clues analysed and descriptions of the setters’ armoury make all the difference. It still takes time for it all to sink in, but don’t feel disheartened if you have an off day. Some puzzles catch us all off the wavelength. As was discussed yesterday, it helps not to get hung up on a clue, but to move on until you have some crossing letters to help. I often find myself starting at the bottom of the grid and working back to the top.
        2. Just to echo the other words of encouragement: cryptic crosswords are basically impossible when you start, so certainly don’t be dispirited. I’ve been doing these things for nearly fifteen years, and remember spending many a frustrated hour trying in vain to build out from some easy anagram opener I’d managed to spot before throwing the thing away in disgust. Yes there are a lot of tricks, conventions and jargon that you simply have to learn, but so does every good game, and it’s a richly rewarding diversion if you do.
      3. Thanks, good to know someone else struggles. A bit of a turn off all the 8 minute solvers posting times and sort of feels like it is designed to make one feel stupid. Will keep at it a bit longer
    2. I didn’t find this easy at all today but I’m filing away some of the unknowns e.g. Gary, Gilt and Shallop for future reference. I have been doing the QC for just under two years now and have just started doing the 15×15. I marvel at some of the solving times of the regulars when I have yet to finish one but this just makes me more determined. I learn so much from their blogs. Keep up the good work!
  13. Insisted on trying to find a 6 letter French town without considering that “at first” might apply to ‘gag’ as well as ‘heard’, and without that checker COUNTERPART just did not come. Otherwise found it all very straightforward. Ah well, always tomorrow.
    PlayUpPompey
  14. DNK Gary or SHALLOP but trusted to the wordplay. Slightly easier than average judging by my time. Like others, I enjoyed the reminder of ROUND THE CLOCK golf. A long time since I played that too!
  15. So I thought my time of 16:20 wasn’t too bad given that I biffed so many i.e 8a ROUND THE CLOCK, 10a GUILT 12a SUGARY 13a AT HOME and 12dn SHALLOP having to rely on the wordplay for the last two. My LOI 9d COUNTERPART held me up a good 2 mins over my average…..but at least I understood the parsing at the PDM. I also thought 11a was a difficult clue. Not an easy QC today but still enjoyable. Thank you for the blog.
  16. I solved this quickly in about 16 minutes but came here wondering about Shallops, Reeds and Guilt. In each case the clue was clear enough to overcome the unknowns.
    FOI was Pony, an expression I’ve not seen for years,but remembered immediately.
    Now back to watching The Open. David
  17. Well north of 4 Kevins, dear oh dear. As BJ herself would have said, A Bad Day.I am reluctantly concluding that how fast I do the QC on the morning train is directly related to how much whisky I drank the night before and how late I went to bed.

    FOI SHRUG, LOI REEDS (had no idea that these were organ stops, thought they were in woodwind instruments only! – “Organ stops are sorted into four major types: principal, string, reed, and flute”, ye ken the noo as my grandmother would have said), struggled for ages over REDETERMINE (thought ET was going to be at the end) and SUGARY (Port Gary? seriously?!). Had to nerve myself to write in SHALLOP as well.

    Hey ho, the virtues of temperance.

    Templar

  18. Sometimes I wonder how my life’s accumulation of knowledge can include stuff like young pigs, places in Indiana, cockney slang for money and illicit booze. Who knew they would all be needed for the same crossword? SHALLOP slipped through the net though. 5:47

    Edited at 2018-07-19 05:43 pm (UTC)

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