Times Quick Cryptic 1980 by Teazel

64 comments on “Times Quick Cryptic 1980 by Teazel”

1. Put in TATAMI without a thought, but then I would, wouldn’t I? The one I wasn’t sure about was ARROGATE, since I had thought the town was Harrowgate. 5:41.
2. I did know Tatami, but the grid didn’t make it easy without first letters. Like Kevin, I misspelt (H)arrogate with 2 gs and 1 r initially making it difficult to get my LOI 2 down. Ethereal also gave me pause for thought but all in all a good challenge today, done in under 20 for me.
3. This was a DNF for me, with three clues unanswered. I started very well, quickly answering about half of the clues. The remainder, save the three unanswered, took a while. Some help needed from Chambers, but not even aids could help me finish.

   Did not like 6a TATAMI. Never heard of it. Only guessed it from the checking letters, and even then had to check the dictionary to see if my guess was in fact a word.

   Disappointing to have a DNF as I started so well.

4. Just me who always thinks of an outboard as a motor not an engine? (They are obvious synonyms but took me ages to see it!)

   Pb

   1. I’d always say ‘outboard motor’ but a motor is an engine (at least in layman’s language) so I didn’t have a problem with the clue.
5. A brisk start to the week, with a minor hold up at the end for the MOVEMENT part of 2d. I’d heard of TATAMI but I did think it could cause problems for those without the relevant GK. I imagine Teazel’s choice of word was influenced by the 1st column of the grid.
   An enjoyable solve completed in 7.27 with the standout clues for me being LOGS IN and ARROGATE.
   Thanks to Jack
   1. Good spot about the first column.

      Enjoyed this puzzle although it was a slow solve and almost into SCC.
      FOI LOGS IN
      LOI SHOULDER
      COD OUTBOARD

   2. Brilliant spot. Well done.
   3. Ah, just seen the tease.
   4. We’ll spotted!
   5. I’m still not seeing 1st column tease, would you make it more obvious for me?
      1. Just look at the letters in col 1 — they spell out the setter’s name 😉

         Good spot, Plett. I do hope Teazel isn’t going to start shoving in ninas as well now, though!

         Edited at 2021-10-11 05:41 pm (UTC)

         1. Ah, very good. I was looking at column 2, being the 1st column with answers, but, of course, that’s wrong.
            1. 👍

6. COD 10 a for me. Came in under 16 but had to check tatami. Thanks Teazel and Jack

7. Had a vague memory of TATAMI but waited for checkers before committing. SHOULDER also took a little time, but otherwise it all gradually filled in down the grid. A pleasant start to the week, 18 minutes.

   Edited at 2021-10-11 08:01 am (UTC)

8. Only thing was, at first I put LOGS ON tho it did not parse and made LOI HIDE difficult until penny dropped. Was also a bit slow on GOLDFISH BOWL (COD) in spite of pondering about fishtank at one stage.
   Fortunately FOI TATAMI sprang to mind straight away. ARROGATE also wafted in there, thanks to Fred Sirieix’s pronunciation in a TV show. (French not cockney)
   A witty QC, much enjoyed.
   Thanks vm, Jack.

   Edited at 2021-10-11 11:41 am (UTC)

9. Like Countrywoman, I wanted to write in logs on, but my attempt to parse it failed so I thought again. I managed a fair rate of progress despite a rather unfriendly grid and I ended up dead on target. NHO TATAMI which only went in when I had all the crossers and then I chuckled and crossed my fingers. I liked APPOSITE, ARROGATE, and GOLDFISH BOWL. My LOI was FLOG which took some time. Many thanks to Teazel and Jack. John M.
10. Was on for a fine sub 10, but stared at MASS MOVEMENT for longer than the rest of the entire puzzle. Could not see it. Was thinking it might be a Latin phrase like Nunc Dimittis.

    NHO ARROGATE, was thinking about ‘abrogate’ which is a word I know (and actually use).

11. I shot myself in the foot trying to get a fast time. I submitted after 08:52 with POLICE at 17d; a minute’s thought would have helped.
    I actually thought that TATAMI was likely to be wrong so I was less bothered. DNK the word and like Jack had to guess.
    Otherwise some very good clues. I liked OUTBOARD,LOGS IN and FLOG.
    Credit to Teazel.
    David
12. … where just like Merlin I was held up by 2D Mass movement. Up to then I was going very nicely on what I thought was a good puzzle (and I did spot the first column!), but several minutes on the LOI pushed me out to 14 minutes in all. I did eventually get it, but I am torn between thinking it a very clever clue, misleading me all over the place (I wasn’t even clear which bit was the definition and which the cryptic), and actually a rather messy clue as the definition bit at the end does not in my view quite work: masses are not on the whole broken up into movements (it’s more a phrase used in symphonic music) and mass movement is not a term any church musician would ever use.

    Many thanks to Jack for the blog. Only 20 more puzzles before we reach the 2,000th — I wonder if the editor has anything special in store for us.
    Cedric

    1. Unless we all missed it there was nothing in QC#1000 to mark the occasion other than it was compiled by Des, a very occasional setter who gave us the very first QC back in 2014.

       If he returns to set for the next milestone we may need to be on our toes as his most recent three contributions have made use of themes or other lexicographic devices.

       Strictly speaking the 2000th puzzle will be QC#1999 as the Christmas Day puzzle in 2014 was not allotted a number.

       1. That reminds me of the dilemma around when we should have celebrated the millennium – 31st Dec. 1999 or 31st Dec. 2000. In the Random household we celebrated both – just in case!
       2. Wasn’t QC 1000 the one where all the answers were composed of only those letters in ONE THOUSAND?
          1. Many thanks, Lou, and you’re quite right. I blogged the puzzle myself and mentioned it in some detail on the day but I had failed to record it in my QC archive. An omission now rectified. All being well I shall be blogging #2000 too so I shall try to be prepared for whatever comes up, whoever the setter.
13. Ten minutes, all parsed except for palace, got from Buckingham without bothering further. FOI egos, twelve on first pass. LOI hide as I had logs on until I realised it couldn’t be, and hide was obvious with the great gift that is hindsight. I’ve lived in ‘arrogate, but didn’t know arrogate as a word. Enjoyed the whole puzzle, but COD goldfish bowl if I had to pick one. Thanks, Jack, and Teazel.
14. Very slow starting with only 5 or 6 on the first pass, but then everything fell into place all of a sudden as my brain woke up for my second-ever sub-10 minute solve at 9:05, with LOI FLOG.

    Liked GOLDFISH BOWL a lot, enjoyed APPOSITE.

    Thanks Jackkt and Teazel

15. Mass movement as a phrase shows nearly all the google hits as a movement of rocks earth etc.
    Andyf
    1. It’s not a lexicological term with that meaning though.

       Here’s Collins: a movement in which large numbers of people are involved
       The Church for them was not a mass movement in which individuals were lost.

       1. But enthusiasm is a bit of a stretch. Took ages to get this and it was LOI
16. Caught out by TATATI, as I’d bunged in TI at the end and didn’t rethink it when TATA appeared. ‘Twas of little importance as I somehow shoved an inexplicable KANGEROO in at 1d. The second part of MASS MOVEMENT held me up at the end too. 11:22 with 2 errors. My excuse is rushing to vacate my room by the exit time and packing the car before flopping in the lounge to do the puzzle. Mind you it didn’t affect my attempt at the 15×15 which I did straight afterwards. Time to head back to the North East from Cheese country now. Thanks Teazel and Jack.
17. TATAMI from me, though Jack’s point is valid that without the GK, it could have been TATATI.

    I failed to spot the “signature”.

    No arguments from me really full stop, as I seem to be 10th on the leaderboard as of now, and ahead of Phil. I’d have been even quicker if I’d spotted the hidden LATTES, which enabled MASS MOVEMENT to finally drop into place.

    GOLDFISH BOWL, APPOSITE and SHOULDER were my favourites.

    3:53

    1. Or TARATI.. As it happens, I spoke to the editor at the Cheltenham Festival today (crossword event) and he realised it was not a great clue for the QC.
       1. Or indeed TARAMI as per jamesed46 below!
18. ….MASS MOVEMENT. It was caused by 4 pints of Draught Bass and a Lamb Jalfrezi. I spotted MASS early, but MOVEMENT only came once I spotted ARROGATE.

    TATAMI was a write-in if you knew the word, but I suspect you’d not find one in Wilko’s.

    Never spotted TEAZEL’s “signature — a clever flourish.

    FOI TATAMI
    LOI TRAM (no idea why !)
    COD GOLDFISH BOWL
    TIME 4:06

    Edited at 2021-10-11 10:22 am (UTC)

19. After 20 mins I had completed everything, but a glance at the blog showed my guessed answer for 6ac was wrong. Unlike “Tatami” or “Tataki”, I had “Tarami” which is another possible definition of farewell.

    Didn’t mind the rest of it — lived quite near Harrogate for a while so that wasn’t an issue, but 2dn “Mass Movement” took longer than it should have as I had the definition wrong and was thinking it was music that was specifically religious.

    FOI — 9ac “Egos”
    LOI — 6ac dnf/incorrect
    COD — 8ac “Goldfish Bowl” — worked in an office for a while that had one of these as a meeting room.

    Thanks as usual!

    Edited at 2021-10-11 10:26 am (UTC)

20. Too hard for me – gave up after 20 mins.

    These QCs are just to tough. In future I will leave the solving to the experts and just have a glance at this blog every day to muse on the answers.

    1. If you enjoy them in principle, do as much as you can, then revert for the ones you missed. As you’ll know, certain days are easier than others! If it’s not fun, though….

    2. A good way to get started is to check the blog for the across clues you can’t get and then see if that helps you with the downs

    3. Please remember that absolutely everyone on this site started somewhere and somewhen. For me, just seeing the wit and wisdom of the clues and answers is a joy. If you can solve one clue then you are on your way. Then you will solve two and a year later you will be explaining the answers for other new solvers. One step at a time.
    4. Don’t you mean ‘too’ tough!?
21. Pushed into SCC territory by MASS MOVEMENT (LOI), TATAMI and ZONE. Otherwise I thought this a clever QC from Teazel, in an awkward grid and with the clever device in the first column. I’m not sure that COWARD equates with weakling, but I’ll forgive that, however, I find it more difficult to excuse the TATAMI and 2d, the first for the reasons Jackkt gave and the second because the definition doesn’t really work. I was only a few seconds into the SCC, but a disappointing start to the week.
22. 4:18 this morning. Fairly straightforward, apart from 6a c “tatami”, where I would accept the comments of Jack and others that it’s not a watertight clue. Fortunately I was already aware of the word (probably from all the Murakami novels I have read over the years). Not 100% sure what 11 ac “arrogate” actually meant but the wordplay was unequivocal this time.
    COD 8 d “goldfish bowl”.
    Didn’t see Teazel’s signature — but no surprise there!
    Thanks to Jack for the blog and other comments and to Teazel for a good start to the week.
23. Guessed TATAMI and submitted tentatively. Appreciated GOLDFISH BOWL, took ages over MASS MOVEMENT (wasn’t wholly convinced), TRAM took me a while to parse for some reason, and NHO ARROGATE. Love learning new words and really enjoyed this one. Many thanks Teazel and Jack.
24. My first 26 minutes went very well, as I solved 21 of the 23 clues – excellent progress for me. I particularly enjoyed SHOULDER, and guessed TATAMI correctly (TATATI just didn’t sound right, somehow). I needed HIDE before I could decide between LOGS IN and LOGS ON, and it was only then that I fully parsed the clue.

    My second 26 minutes pretty much sucked the life out of me, as it took that long to solve _R___ATE (ARROGATE) and MASS ___E_E_T (MASS MOVEMENT). I was reduced to a series of extensive alphabet trawls, none of which yielded anything to do with either clue (other than MASS INTEREST). I thought of various spa towns, but Harrogate took more than 20 minutes to arrive. Even then it still took me 4-5 minutes to find MOVEMENT. I was finding words like GRADUATE, IRADIATE, ORDINATE, PROSTATE, TRUNCATE, … but nothing which fitted with the clue.

    When I eventually finished, in 26 minutes, I put down my pencil with a sort of gloomy/numb feeling, rather than any sense of joy.

    Mrs Random, however, breezed in part-way through, knocked it off in 18 minutes, and disappeared to check on her pizza dough and granary dough. Our second son, who we don’t see very often, has arrive for a couple of nights, so she decided that some wholesome home-made fodder is required. The ‘QC struggle’ is not equally shared in this house.

    Many thanks to Teazel and to jackkt.

25. A bit of a struggle but managed in the end except for TATAMI – unknown.
26. Really good start to the week with some very amusing clues. NHO ARROGATE but Steed (being from that neck of the woods) was all over it. As Japanophiles we are familiar with TATAMI so that was a write in for us. We were all done in 8 minutes.

    FOI: TATAMI
    LOI: SHOULDER
    COD: GOLDFISH BOWL

    Thanks Jackkt and Teazel.

27. For 19d, tramp for walk is unfair quick clue too
    SRT
    1. Tramping is a popular term in New Zealand and relates to hillwalking/hiking/backpacking etc.
    2. Have you never enjoyed a tramp in the countryside?
28. All green in 13, loved KANGAROO for the brilliant PDM but less keen on ARROGATE and TATAMI both of which we could have been spared had it not been for the first column antics. Harrumph.
29. Enjoyable but did not know Tatami or Arrogate — even dismissed after Mrs LHR suggested Harrogate…

    Arrogate just doesn’t sound right as a word to me.

    No real time, but at least 30 minutes before conceding on these last two.

    Thanks all
    John George

30. I like to go for a tramp in the woods with my dog….

    … The tramps are getting a bit fed up with it, though.

    1. Thanks Merlin. That made me helpless with laughter for a good 30 seconds! No idea why, it’s just one of those silly gags that hits my funny bone.
31. Got through the majority of this puzzle fairly quickly, however was a DNF thanks to MASS MOVEMENT (I had put in MASS IN… as I thought great=MASS popular=IN etc.).

    Also couldn’t get OUTBOARD. Annoying considering I have just finished the restoration of a Johnson 25.
    As others have mentioned, I saw engine and didn’t even entertain an outboard — which I consider a motor, although they are clearly both.

    Enjoyable nonetheless, thought I was onto a winner for a while!

    Edited at 2021-10-11 03:00 pm (UTC)

32. We also needed to check 6a for ti or mi, otherwise an enjoyable puzzle which made us work hard to finish in 30m, our target time.

33. The karate mat is pronounced TARATI hereabouts at IKEA Shanghai. What a rotten clue!?

    FOI 1dn KANGAROO LOI 2dn MOVEMENT = BOUNCE?

    COD 11ac ARROGATE. Agatha Christie went missing in 1926 and tipped up at an hotel in ‘Arrogate. She was having a fling with……. shortly after they wrote a joint publication. I am sworn to secrecy.

    WOD 4dn Ford FIESTA the old rust bucket from ‘Hitchhiker’s’

34. Very much a similar experience as everyone else! We went to peer through the windows at Betty’s in ‘Arrogate earlier this year, having seen Fred and Nadiya having tea there on tv. Sadly, the cafe was closed (still in semi-lockdown) so we just bought fat rascals and had a takeaway instead! Yum 😋
    FOI Logs in
    LOI Mass movement (took two minutes on the second part of that alone)
    COD Kangaroo
    12 mins. I didn’t see the signature. I wonder why Teazel chose to do that today? An anniversary of some sort?
    Thanks to him and Jack
35. Tatami? Please! I was struggling with this anyway and also failed to get mass movement, but as the blog says this was a matter of guesswork and I guessed wrong.
36. I’m another one of the solvers for whom TATAMI was my FOI. But I’ve been to Japan dozens of times. As usual, whether something qualifies as fair general knowledge tends to depend simply on whether you know it or not. No problem with ARROGATE nor the spa town. My LOI was TRAM like several others, although I think “tramp” is perfectly fair.
37. Just to point this out, and I think we’ve done this before, that a web page is NOT a website. I think we’ve also discussed the equivalence or otherwise of software and app but I think that is fair. A website is a collection of pages held on a webserver hosted on a specific machine or domain. A webpage is a sub-item of a site and could never be considered a site in itself. I can print a webpage out and give it to a friend – that printout could still be called a webpage, but it would never ever be called a site.
    1. Well it’s a fair point, and I had considered it when I wrote my blog, but I’ve visited number of websites that consist of no more than a single page.
       1. Even in the relatively rare case where a site hosts a single page, the page itself doesn’t constitute the site. The site is really the hosting technology which provides the pages – both the domain/balancing and webserver/CGI scripts/database and so on. Pages or even a single page could be and often are dynamically generated by the hosting technology and so again a page is one end result which is served back to the requestor from the hosting site. Even if the page is static it is an end result of a GET request to the site of the particular URL. From no technological viewpoint can a page be a site.
          1. A good analogy would be a bookstore and books. We think of a bookstore containing many books, but even if there was only one book in the bookstore you’d still never call the store a book. The bookstore is a building made of bricks, a book is made of paper.

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