Times 28204 – rise and rinse

101 comments on “Times 28204 – rise and rinse”

1. No problems or holdups, but a silly mistake with LOI ATTESTER (sic): A / TT = time-trial at e.g Tour de France / ?ESTER? = a type of Ford car prevalent in the UK. Oh well. Otherwise only one misparsing: EAST WARDS for the hospital wing – a wing likely has many storeys means many wards? Took a while to see CHAR, WOOD AVENS pencilled straight in and never needed erasing, EARLY BATH a confident guess. Got to ABUZZ with the Z in place so no trouble, known as I lived there a year. I do like ASTIR, though.
   1. I think that is a better parsing of east wards
      1. I took it as EAST WARD’S.
   2. I had exactly the same reasoning for my pink E in ATTESTER. Otherwise enjoyed this despite all the new vocab — COD to the early bath. Thanks witty setter and George for unpicking that one and more.
   3. Would that be the Ford Fee-ester?
      1. I’ve been to UK, and seen Ford: Fiestas, Sierras, Kas (at least on ads on TV). None of them appear in Australia. We have Ford Falcons, which I don’t think you have. Cortinas from memory are in both countries.
         But it is easy to imagine a random car-name, in these days of rampant product-placement in the Times crossword.
2. I found this an easy glide after last week. I liked Early Bath for the vocabulary, and I pleased myself by properly deducing that a setter might, in fact, clue dave as David and that el+dr made more sense than e-md-l when I constructed 3d and 1d, respectively. I didn’t please myself by putting Saute in as a placeholder and then forgetting to come back and figure the right answer out.
   1. I too had SAUTE for a while… kept trying to parse it!
      1. I knew it was wrong — that isn’t what saute means, and the parsing didn’t work. I have no idea why I put the placeholding letters into the grid. None. But it was tempting, wasn’t it.

         Edited at 2022-02-03 04:09 pm (UTC)

         1. The definition definitely would be loose!
3. …nearly my last. (Soccer, hmm, OK.)
   I got off to a good start, alternating between quadrants from the edges, eventually slowed by a few posers. CALLED TO THE BAR came much later than the other fourteener, though I think (now) that I’d heard of the above-mentioned Gray’s. N-ever-HO WOOD AVENS though.
   “Shout” came up as a round of drinks somewhere recently, maybe in one of the Jumbos…? But SHUT-OUT was nevertheless my LOI.
   I also had ASTIR instead of ABUZZ for too long. The long bottle eventually took care of that.

   Edited at 2022-02-03 05:03 am (UTC)

   1. It could be any of the Inns of Court, no? not necessarily Gray’s. Or am I missing something?
      1. Well, I haven’t looked it up yet. The mention in the blog just rang a faint, tinny bell. Like your “Inns of Court” now. Hmm…
         1. Yes, the four Inns of Court are the Middle and Inner Temple, Lincoln’s Inn and Gray’s Inn. So only the latter two have ‘Inn’ in the title but they are all Inns of Court.
      2. my thoughts too as a member of one of them, I suppose on a narrow reading of ‘Inn’ it could be limited to Gray’s or Lincoln’s rather than Middle or Inner Temple …thanks setter and blogger, excellent as ever
         1. There used to be more of them but the other ones fell into disuse so it’s down to the four now. Mine’s Lincoln’s, Rumpole’s chambers are in one of the Temples.
            1. E.g. Thavies’ Inn and Staple Inn? Names I have heard but have not investigated the history…
      3. You’re missing that Grey’s is the only one I know of.
         1. Well I suppose it is the most famous as it has a big road named after it.
      4. The other Inns of Court are Inner Temple, Middle Temple and Lincoln’s Inn. Could be any of the Inns I think.
   2. In case you hadn’t noticed, The Times is an English newspaper, in a land whose national sport is football (or soccer, if you prefer). So why the “hmm, O.K.”? If you don’t like English references in an English paper,I suggest you stick to the New York Times. The US-centricity of this board is unbelievable in this context.
      1. Dear AnonyMouse,

         This is a flabbergasting comment.

         How anyone can read so much into such a slight passing remark… which was merely meant to reflect that this term is new to me (yes, a Murican!).

         I fully expect to find such references in a British puzzle. I try to remember them for the next time they appear. So I stop and ponder. “Hmm… OK!” Meaning only that I had to check it.

         But I don’t know much about American football either. On Thursday thru Sunday, I work the New York Times crosswords (but they’re noncryptic!). If a sports reference appears, it often slows me down!

         Edited at 2022-02-04 12:18 am (UTC)

      2. To Anonymous.

         Comments in this vein are not welcome here. Anything along similar lines posted by you will be deleted.

         Edited at 2022-02-03 07:03 pm (UTC)

4. I used aids to find WOOD AVENS and Aquae Sulis, biffed EASTWARDS & RECHART.
5. Rather annoyingly I forgot to note my solving time, but I don’t think it was many minutes over my half-hour target which was not bad considering how many unknown words or references it contained. It’s a mark of a good cryptic puzzle that it was solvable despite that.

   I’m very surprised considering my background in music that I don’t recall ever seeing INTRADA before – I probably did but have forgotten it. Similarly PAS SEUL, although I knew ‘pas de deux’, so that was easier. WOOD AVENS was another – an alternative name for bennet or herb bennet according to Collins, but I never heard of that either!

   Edited at 2022-02-03 06:31 am (UTC)

   1. Same here with INTRADA, despite my background.
   2. My problem was seeing IN + TRIO, and trying to figure out how to reverse the IO and get the T for INTROIT
6. My usual 30 minutes and I knew all of the vocabulary except INTRADA which was not difficult. It helped that I live near Bath and have been to the four Inns of Court many times in my professional life.
7. DNF with an errant (in more than one way) Balshazar. I blame Walton…

   And Bryn Terfel.

8. Somewhat surprised to finish in 45 minutes, given that this felt two or three times as hard as every other puzzle this week.

   Maybe I’m just a bit woolier-headed than usual. Too much unknown vocab to recount, and I also managed to shoot myself in the foot by putting the enumeration for 15d in the 14d slot so spent the last few minutes wondering whether LARCE NOUS was French or Latin! D’oh.

9. Once again pleased to finish accurately. Managed to avoid the ATTESTOR problem. Didn’t parse RECHART. Liked EARLY BATH, but COD to BALTHAZAR.

   Thanks george and setter.

10. 54 minutes. Entered the NHO WOOD AVENS and my LOI RECHART as the most likely possibilities from wordplay and def respectively and only half-parsed EARLY BATH. More by good luck than design, I managed to avoid the potential “astir” trap, so with the few unknowns, happy to have finished with all safely in.
11. No real problems today. Thank you, George, for RECHART and for SOUSE.
    I didn’t know JO was another word for sweetheart.
    COD definitely goes to EARLY BATH, both for the Aquae Sulis part but also because it reminded me of the great Eddie Waring. In the early days of Grandstand on BBC TV on Saturday afternoon, the staple diet was horse racing and rugby league. For the rugby, the BBC unearthed a Yorkshire diamond in Eddie. His accent and commentary style became much mimicked. “He’s going for an EARLY BATH” was his standard phrase after a player had been sent off. Wonderful!
    1. There’s a Scottish song, “Whatshisname’s my Jo”, which is how I knew the term, although clearly forgot the name; which is John Anderson, I see, with lyrics by Burns, yet.
       1. Thanks, Kevin.
12. 36:05
    Got through it no problem. NHO wood avens, but wp was clear.
    Thanks, g.
13. Till you have drenched our steeples, drowned the cocks!

    30 mins pre-brekker, so a bit more confidence boosting than yesterday’s struggle.
    I dredged up Eldritch and Pas Seul, but NHO Wood Avens, nor Sloppy Joe.
    Thanks setter and G.

14. It didn’t bode well that last night I dreamt that I attended the crossword championship and it was ridiculously hard, with the second puzzle being a Listener. Not that today’s crossword was ridiculously hard, but I did manage to fail with a partially parsed ATTESTER. Like isla3 I took TT to be time trial leaving me wondering how to get to ESTER. I see now that ATTESTER is an acceptable spelling so if I can find a way to parse ESTER I’ll demand a steward’s enquiry.
    1. Word search threw up WESTERN for the Ford that had to be stripped. Hollywood director John Ford made lots of westerns, including the iconic Stagecoach with John Wayne.
       That’s a Ford western, though not a car as I hadthought!
       1. Excellent work! I take that as a victory for us.
       2. Ingenious, but I don’t think it will wash.
    2. That was not a dream, pootle, that was a nightmare!
15. Took me a while to get going with this, with most of the progress in the bottom half (once I’d decided where to put PERFECT). Up top I had there were multiple unknowns (WOOD AVENS, INTRADA, DUOMO) and uncertainties (SPOUT for “rabbit” seemed a bit iffy). By 30m I was expecting a hard slog ahead…

    …until I wrote down the anagrist for 13a, figured that out, and everything started falling into place in a most satisfying and agreeable way. Other NHOs (LAERTES, PAS SEUL) were sufficiently clear that I was able to submit with a lot of confidence. Delighted with turnaround in fortunes and successful outcome – thanks G and setter.

16. The study round here is quite brown
    My verse yesterday got thumbs down
    Perhaps I was too rude
    Perhaps you are a prude
    But I’ll stop if it makes people frown
    1. Don’t you dare, unless it’s to switch to clerihews or sonnet form. Haikus? As far as I can see you only got one thumbs down and the ST compilers regularly get more than that from me alone!
       1. Thanks for cheering me up 🙂

          I would like to emphasise that the very last thing I want to do is upset anyone

          1. If the only complaint’s from Shanghai
             Ascribe to a stressful CNY
             All those dried mushrooms
             And a tetchy mood looms
             Take it from one who suffers like I
    2. Though the prose here can tend to the florid,
       And the arguments sometimes seem torrid,
       Your humorous metre
       Keeps the atmosphere sweeter,
       So pay no attention to Horryd!
       1. An aging old git known as Horry,
          Writes to say he’s incredibly sorry!
          For upsetting ‘our bard’,
          Who took it quite hard,
          Whilst Ulaca and K said – do not worry!

          horryd

    3. I see you got three likes and one don’t like, from Horrid of course.
       That amounts to a strong vote of confidence ..
       1. that horrid white cat turns up to dig its claws in. The bloke apologised, did he not?!
    4. I too enjoy your verses — something I always watch out for when reading the comments section.
    5. It’s always a highlight even if I forget to press the like button.
       And since we’re in the rhyming vein:

       My verses never quite measure
       Unlike yours which are always a pleasure
       To read on this blog,
       Which can be a slog
       Of moans, hiding your hidden treasure.

    6. If I remember I said « nice one »
       Your rhymes are always good fun
       So please do not worry
       If our good friend Horry
       Occasionally finds fault with a pun.
17. 44 minutes with LOI WOOD AVENS, an unknown as was SLOPPY JOE. I’d heard of this only as a pizza, and then usually as Giuseppe. ABUZZ was a biff. COD has to go to EARLY BATH and the memories of Eddie Waring, as Martin has said. Quite a tough puzzle. Thank you George and setter.
    1. The pizza is always Sloppy Giuseppe, I think: it’s a play on words, Sloppy Joe being mince sauce in a burger bun. This was how I knew it too, from Pizza Express.
18. 23:22. I found this really hard. I’m not sure why: there were a few unknowns but they didn’t really slow me down. Even WOOD AVENS, which I still can’t quite believe is a thing.
    My last in by a long shot was RECHART: an odd word and I completely failed to parse it. Not the first time I have been flummoxed by the old SINGER trick.
19. Happy to finish this despite the unknown PAS SEUL and WOOD AVENS. Less happy to find SAUTE and ATTESTER were wrong. I couldn’t parse SAUTE but had hoped our blogger might do that for me. He failed. Like Pootle I wondered how ESTER could be a stripped Ford. Did Hollywood have a Ford who made Western movies? Apparently not.
    32:43 with pink damage.

20. Deservedly failed with an unparsed SAUTE, but very enjoyable (EARLY BATH, PAS SEUL, BALTHAZAR) despite the final disappointment. Thank you, glheard and the setter.

21. I lived in Bath 4 or 5 times (in those days the Royal Navy’s research labs were there and my Dad worked there). So the Aquae Sulis clue that confused people wa a write in for me. Never heard of WOOD AVENS. Living in the US, SLOPPY JOE is something completely different but the wordplay was generous. I had to work out ELDRITCH from the wordplay too.
22. I still struggle to believe that ELDRITCH is an adjective… I don’t know why, but it just doesn’t feel like one to me (of course it doesn’t help that I don’t think I’ve ever seen it outside of crossword-land).

    ABUZZ went in unparsed, I didn’t know the casual wear meaning of SLOPPY JOE, I relied on the wordplay for the unknown WOOD AVENS and INTRADA, and I didn’t figure out the ‘char’ in RECHART at all. But I enjoyed this a lot.

    FOI Adult
    LOI Wood avens
    COD Early bath

    1. This is a word I’ve known since schooldays as it was the surname of an English master who came to us for a term of teaching practice. Of course somebody looked it up in a dictionary and found: weird, ghostly, unnatural; hideous, and word of this soon got round. Poor man! I hope he passed his inspection but, knowing how cruel small boys can be, I think he might have done his career a favour if he had changed his name.
    2. I agree, it is a strange word — you could say that Eldritch is an eldritch word.
       Looking it up, it appears to derive from Middle English meaning “different (else) kingdom” or possibly “elf kingdom”.
       So, a magical word that doesn’t sound magical.
    3. Have a bash of some HP Lovecraft and derivatives. Phrases like “eldritch horror” will be tripping off your tongue in no time. I won’t guarantee the quality of your sleep, though.
       1. Gothic horror?
          1. Oddly, my nom de net comes from science fiction rather than horror: William Gibson’s Count Zero…

             Edited at 2022-02-05 08:51 am (UTC)

23. 33.47 so another toughie for me. Worked out wood avens and intrada but confess to checking to see if they were right. Both unfamiliar words to me. Got rechart but didn’t know why. FOI early bath, LOI rechart.

    COD eastwards mainly cos it took so long and produced a temple bashing moment.
    Thx setter and blogger.

24. Boy am I glad it wasn’t my week: all that work to unpick “are singers”=CHAR, which Italian region it was that you somehow used, and where the USE came from in “regularly take to cook” – surely that’s either OOK or TCO? For me a case of hope for the best and trust George, which faith did not disappoint.
    I liked the clever use of Inn for the bar calling: I once had lunch with Lord Denning at Lincoln’s Inn, liver and onions, as I recall.
    I read at least one of the Pollyanna books (Door to Happiness, I think) as a child: it still feels strange that other people would get the reference.
    An interesting grid with some close-to-monthly-special words, taking me just under the 20 minutes.
    1. The food is pretty good at Lincoln’s now Z but in those days the waitress would often tell you – I wouldn’t have that if I were you.
25. Found this enjoyable and reasonably straightforward,
    though I need to come here to understand the singers in RECHART. WOOD AVENS and PAS SEUL new to me but easily gettable.

    BALTHAZAR brought back happy memories of reading J.P. Donleavy’s very funny Beastly Beatitudes of Balthazar B.

    Thanks to glheard and the setter

26. Finished with fingers crossed, because I, too, completely forgot about the sneaky way to parse “singers”. Odd how one can never get caught out by “flower” but still overlook that one. Ah well. I’d never heard of / can’t remember hearing of INTRADA or WOOD AVENS, so it was unfortunate that they crossed, but as already said, the wordplay was very clear. Not the only moderately testing vocabulary, though JO is well-known to Scrabble players who want to ditch an unwelcome J from their rack. Enjoyable.
27. I knew this was going to be tricky when my FOI, WASPERY for 23a, was negated by my 3rd one in ATTESTOR(at least I got the right Ford). 2nd one in NOSE JOB was my first correct entry, although I wondered how JO was sweetheart. Next one in was SLEEPY JOE which I fortuitously managed to correct during proof reading when I noticed that LARCENOUS had altered it. DUOMO, SPOUT and SOUSE all caused consternation and neuron bashing, but surrendered in the end. I also had no idea of the Italian region, but the big bottle and definition gave me ABUZZ. LAERTES went in with a grin of appreciation. PAS SEUL was constructed from wordplay and crossers, as were WOOD AVENS and RECHART, although I also missed the cunning misdirection of singers. LOI was SOUSE, corrected at the last minute from SAUCE, which, of course, wouldn’t parse. A fun if testing puzzle. 40:59. Thanks setter and George.
28. The bottom half went in far easier than the top half, apart from ATTESTOR which needed an extra ounce of thought.

    With only EASTWARDS, ELDRITCH (easy to remember if you liked the band The Sisters Of Mercy), DUOMO and the unlikely WOOD AVENS above the line drawn by CALLED TO THE BAR, it was a slow slog picking up the odd answer from then on.

    TIRADE, SPRAT, OVERFED and SHUT OUT went in before SPOUT, INTRADA (I did check it was ‘a thing’) and REINFLATE.

    RECHART was the key to the last few, giving COUTURIER and then some minutes thought about SAUTE which I couldn’t parse, so dug more deeply into the clue….

    1. I was taught by Sisters of Mercy at primary school. They didn’t have any!
       1. You don’t sing Leonard Cohen’s song then, John?
29. The bottom half seemed so easy (apart from ABUZZ, which I never understood — so far as I can see it uses a very seldom seen device) that I thought I was on for a fast time, but the top was a different matter altogether. Lots of nhos or only-just-hos and some hard clues like the RECHART one, so eventually I was using aids and finished at 55 minutes.

    Eddie Waring was the instigator of the early bath I think. I never had much interest in rugby league, but it was worth watching for his wonderful commentary.

30. A speedy 40:39 for me today despite all the unknowns. FOI 1ac EASTWARDS for a good start. LOIs RECHART, INTRADA and WOOD AVENS all together in the northwest corner. I thought ADULT was neat, but COD OVERFED. WOD ELDRITCH, which reminded me of H P Lovecraft from way back
31. ….that I was glad to finish off in 11:32. No COD nomination.
32. No I never got the singers either, nearly put RECHANT but it didn’t make any sense.
    NHO WOOD AVENS. Last one was SOUSE, where I assumed the regularly meant either TU from thus or AE from take. My assumption was wrong!
33. I’ve had that dream too Pootle. In one I couldn’t make any of the pens or pencils work and in another I was in my nightgown and desperately trying to hide in a corner.
34. Not tempted by “astir” because I recalled the Lear limerick about the blind man of th’Abruzzi who couldn’t his foot see. I’ve heard of someone being sent to the showers in baseball so EARLY BATH wasn’t too much of a stretch. Had a long think about SOUSE over “saute”. It recalled for me an old Spoonerish story about a reporter calling someone a prominent “white horse souse” (instead of White House source). 22.23
35. 35m here so relatively speedy, with some unknowns worked out from the wordplay. Like others I hesitated over SAUTE for too long and wasn’t convinced by how I got to ABUZZ either. Didn’t see a problem with ATTESTOR so that was a beartrap avoided too. Thank you blogger and setter today. Much appreciated.
36. I don’t think 17AC is intended as a double definition, unless I’m missing something. It’s just TENSE for PRESENT and CONCISE for PERFECT. “Statement of Polyanna’s views” is then the sole defn.
    1. I don’t think that works, as “statement of Polyanna’s views” is not a dictionary definition, however “tense” is the dictionary definition.
       1. Ah, on reflection I think you are right. Sorry!
37. I found this much harder than many of the other commenters. Having succeeded with the NHO wood avens, intrada and eldritch (which vaguely rang a bell) and completed the whole of the bottom half, I couldn’t see 4dn, 6 dn (neither sauce nor sauté would parse), 10 ac or 12 ac. I was on the right lines for 10ac but didn’t see the simple trick of inserting ‘out’. Char from singers was new to me. Have to try to remember that one.

    Thanks to the setter and to our blogger for explaining the mysteries.

38. 26. Seemed trickier at the time than looking back. No issues but a few guesses including INTRADA and WOOD AVENS.
39. Ha ha. The only Laughing Len song I do is Dance Me To The End of Love 🙂
40. Felt easier than yesterday but it’s a higher snitch. Had to guess Avens, and narrowly avoided Rechant and Psyware. Loved Aquae Sulis.
41. 20.41. Good to get a score on the board today and a decent time for a tricky puzzle where a few unknowns (intrada, wood avens, sweetheart Jo and the non-edible sloppy Joe) had me picking my way carefully round a grid where I found the way to be steep and thorny rather than the primrose path of dalliance.
42. Some interesting words today. I have only ever heard the term “Sloppy Joe” in Australia — describing a sweatshirt/hoodie type garment — I’ve never heard it in the UK.
    1. The day after the 1975 Australian election that saw Libs/Fraser beat Labour/Whitlam, the (Pickering) cartoon in the Australian had Gough Whitlam and Bob Hawke (Trade Unions supremo) sitting against the wall the worse for wear after the wake.
       What are you going to do, Gough? asked Bob.
       I think I’ll return to The Bar, said Gough, the lawyer.
       I’ll walk with you, said Bob, at the time an alcoholic.
43. I completely blew the North East sector by shoving in SAUTÉ. The COUTURIER was quite beyond me! And I jacktt it in!

    FOI 1dn ELDRITCH

    (LOI) 4dn RECHART

    COD 3dn WOOD AVENS

    WOD 28ac BALTHAZAR

    Mood Meldrewvian.

44. ‘Pollyana’ derives from the novel from the name of the child heroine in the novel Pollyanna, 1913, by the American writer Eleanor Hodgman Porter (1868 NH – 1920 Cambridge Mass.) Sadly, as a child, I was addicted! She is my WOD. COD Sloppy Joe.
45. Finished at 8:30 and been out all day since, so late to the party. Everything has basically been said. I did like EARLY BATH known more through rugby than soccer. I used to wear a SLOPPY JOE when I was 14. Yoiks.

    Our setter was clearly TIPSY possibly SOUSE(D) and definitely ABUZZ having been CALLED TO THE BAR to fetch his BALTHAZAR of Champagne.

    Thanks to said setter and Mr Heard.

46. 18:57 LOI an unparsed RECHART after SPOUT. Ah that singing! Nice one. As for SLOPPY JOE, I only knew of it vaguely as some American food. I was a bit slow getting going, but eventually tuned in. COD to CALLED TO THE BAR. Thanks George and setter.
47. Lazy
    1. Not my favourite clue, but it’s actually ‘are singers’ = CHAR as George indicated in his blog.
48. Not helped by putting westwards as first one in duh! And don’t forget Lincoln’s Inn too.
49. A few minutes at the end on RECHART even with all the checkers

    I live in Bath and love football so EARLY BATH was a write-in, and with a smile. Nice clue, as was the very clever CALLED TO THE BAR anagram

    ELDRITCH recalled from previous puzzles

    Thanks George and setter

50. An hour and a half, but very enjoyable, though slow going. Somehow nothing came to mind immediately, but fortunately everything did upon long reflection.

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