Times 27391 – Topic 12TS298

Author   vinyl1Posted on Categories Daily Cryptic

Time: 20 minutes
Music: Dexter Gordon, Doin’ Alright

We’re definitely back to easy Monday here.   Every time I thought I was going to get stuck, I saw another obvious one, so thanks for that.   I have a lot of other things to do this week, and I would prefer not to struggle for two hours tonight.   I was hung up on my LOI for a minute or two before seeing how it worked, and I neatly sidestepped the one possible trap for unwary biffers.

Your results may vary, but I would expect some very fast times.   And away we go….

Across
1 What Man Ray was, having a platform in outskirts of Detroit (7)
DADAIST – D(A DAIS)T, rather obvious even if you can’t remember exactly what Man Ray was famous for.
5 A theatre award in New Mexico? It means the opposite (7)
ANTONYM – A N(TONY)M.
9 Self-denying sailors can finally purchase books (9)
ABSTINENT – ABS + TIN + [purchas]E + NT, a nice surface, but not very deceptive.
10 All the players make nearly half the ice cream (5)
TUTTI – half of TUTTI FRUTTI, a rhyming flavour.
11 Daggers produced by old boy and priest (5)
OBELI – OB + ELI, a compendium of cryptic cliches.
12 At that time a group of nations invested in American club (9)
ATHENAEUM – A + THEN + A(E.U)M.   Yeah, let’s put the EU in America!
13 Jurassic creature’s talons oddly displayed in a house (13)
ATLANTOSAURUS – A T(anagram of TALONS)AURUS.   A dubious dinosaur, but well-known.
17 Affected elegance of melodies with decorations (4,3,6)
AIRS AND GRACES – AIR + GRACES, a barely-cryptic clue.
21 Attractive English teacher dips into trifle half-heartedly (9)
DESIRABLE – D(E SIR)A[b]BLE.
24 US city entertaining male climber (5)
LIANA – L(IAN)A, where is was a bit thrown by ‘male’ indicating a random man’s name.  At least ‘liana’ is a stock crossword plant.
25 Stuff oneself with something close to Cheddar? (5)
GORGE – Cheddar GORGE is a geographical feature close to the town of Cheddar.   I didn’t know this, but the answer is pretty evident.
26 When swimming, lady dives with due consideration (9)
ADVISEDLY – anagram of LADY DIVES.
27 Fate sailors reversed, avoiding area by island (7)
NEMESIS – SE[a]MEN backwards + IS.
28 Faker cops finally decisively overcome (7)
SHAMMER – [cop]S HAMMER.   If you biffed scammer, shame (or sham) on you!
Down
1 Racing yacht — something a female impersonator might have? (6)
DRAGON – DRAG ON, referring to the well-known Chinese racing boats.
2 Go with detectives, finding ruin (9)
DISREPAIR – DIS, i.e. detective inspectors, + REPAIR.
3 First letter, one I penned in ancient language going north (7)
INITIAL – I + LA(I)TIN upside-down.
4 Bored agent with woman in Thailand’s borders (9)
TREPANNED – T(REP + ANNE)D, a bit of a surprise.
5 Letter revealing a union problem after seven years? (5)
AITCH – A + ITCH, i.e. the seven-year itch.
6 Giant, one meeting a fairy queen (7)
TITANIA – TITAN + I + A.
7 In action it resembles saltpetre (5)
NITRE – Hidden in [actio]N IT RE[sembles].
8 Part of sailing vessel popular in mother’s time (8)
MAINMAST – MA(IN)MA’S T.
14 Old, old city’s little people — us, emphatically (9)
OURSELVES – O + UR’S ELVES.   We’ll have to check the OT to see if Ur had elves…..
15 Scallywags generally in right order crossing a burn? (9)
RASCALDOM – R(A SCALD)O.M, i.e. the Order of Merit.
16 Eccentric leader leaving NW town for a Welsh one (8)
CARDIGAN – I biffed this one, being familiar with the Earl and his famous sweater, but I now see that it is CARD + [w]IGAN, as in the Road to Wigan Pier.
18 Stuffy, like follicularly challenged Cockneys? (7)
AIRLESS – [h]AIRLESS, one escaped from the Quickie before they stepped up the difficulty levels over there.
19 Church cheers fellow visiting, one giving out notes (7)
CELESTA – CE (LES) TA.
20 Hungarian publication unknown artist set up (6)
MAGYAR – MAG + Y + RA upside-down, an obvious biff.
22 Originally such a strange Wiltshire diocese (5)
SARUM – S[uch] A RUM, well-known from the rotten borough of Old Sarum.
23 The cheek of some musicians! (5)
BRASS – Double definition

63 comments on “Times 27391 – Topic 12TS298”

  1. As Vinyl says. I thought I didn’t know DRAGON, as I’d never considered the boats yachts. Also DNK the dinosaur, and made the mistake of putting the T of TAURUS at the head, which slowed things down. It also took me a while to remember the Cheddar Gorge (I was thinking ‘close to Cheddar’=R), and Wigan. V, for what it’s worth I think the underline at 15d should extend to ‘generally’.

    Edited at 2019-07-01 01:57 am (UTC)

  3. I found it hard (magyar, sarum, nemesis/fate, and dadaist) all unknown but constructed ok.

    Anyway I had 2 errors, spelling mistake in celesta and I went for llama for 24a.

    Cod dragon.

    1. Repair means to move sometimes, like ‘shall we repair to the drawing room?’ as one might say after dinner.

      Edited at 2019-07-01 06:31 am (UTC)

  5. 30 minutes exactly, so bang on my 15×15 target time.

    SHAMMER and RASCALDOM were my last two in – I had wondered if ‘rascaldry’ might be a word.

    NHO the yacht or the disosaur but the wordplay was clear and it helped that for once I remembered ‘house’ can indicate a sign of the zodiac.

    I forgot to go back and parse CARDIGAN after biffing it.

    Not sure that NEMESIS and ‘fate’ are quite the same thing although I can see they may be connected one with the other.

    1. I agree. Nemesis is specifically vengeance and retribution for a previous ‘crime’. Fate is random. Mr Grumpy
      1. The twists of fate often take us by surprise, but the word is defined thusly:
        “the development of events beyond a person’s control, regarded as determined by a supernatural power.
        “fate decided his course for him”
        synonyms: destiny, providence, God’s will, nemesis, kismet, astral influence, the stars, what is written in the stars, one’s lot in life

        And the original sense of “nemesis” is “the inescapable agent of someone’s or something’s downfall.

        “Inescapable” is the key word here.

        Edited at 2019-07-01 07:00 pm (UTC)

        1. Guy, it would be very helpful to know the source when reading a quoted definition, particulary one as detailed as this.

          As mentioned in my original comment I’m sure there’s overlap here so that ‘nemesis’ and ‘fate’ might be interchangeable in some circumstances but I suspect there are others when they are not, yet I’d be pushed if asked to come up with an example just at this moment.

          I think we have established that lists of ‘synonyms’ such as found in a thesaurus are not necessarily reliable and I can imagine for example that any definition involving ‘God’s will’ would be likely to be controversial in some quarters!

          1. This definition is the top result on a Google search on the words “fate definition.”
            It’s very similar to what you’ll find elsewhere.

            Merriam Webster:
            : the will or principle or determining cause by which things in general are believed to come to be as they are or events to happen as they do : DESTINY
            … fate sometimes deals a straight flush … he had no idea that he would become the right man in the right place at the right time …
            — June Goodfield
            2a : an inevitable and often adverse outcome, condition, or end
            Her fate was to remain in exile.
            b : DISASTER
            especially : DEATH
            The villain met his fate at the hands of the hero.

            Collins:
            1. uncountable noun [also N in pl]
            Fate is a power that some people believe controls and decides everything that happens, in a way that cannot be prevented or changed. You can also refer to the fates.

            And here’s Oxford:
            mass noun The development of events outside a person’s control, regarded as predetermined by a supernatural power.

            My point is that inevitability is built into the concept, implying some higher power, regardless of whether one calls it “God,” and this is the connection with the original definition of “nemesis,” as inevitably bringing about one’s downfall.

            It doesn’t matter, of course, that there certainly are cases in which “fate” and “nemesis” are not interchangeable, as long as there is at least one instance in which they are.

            Edited at 2019-07-01 10:33 pm (UTC)

  6. …well apart from the check button, but that’s definite progress for me. So nice not to have to bash the dictionary to finish a puzzle! Even DNKs like OBELI were got through wordplay. Not heard of the dinosaur or the musical instrument either – is that some kind of harp or keyboard?

    Very enjoyable easy start to the week. Not my outright PB, but on brainpower alone, it is.

    Thanks to Vinyl and setter.

    56/58.

    WS

    Edited at 2019-07-01 06:30 am (UTC)

    1. It’s a keyboard instrument most famously featured in Tchaikovsky’s ‘Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy’ (‘Nutcracker’).

      Edited at 2019-07-01 07:42 am (UTC)

  7. 12:06 … well, not entirely Monday-ish. Maybe a bit of Thursday thrown in. I wouldn’t blame anyone who tripped over the mainmast, the celesta, the dinosaur or the collection of rascals. And of course, if you’re fairly new to crosswords everything about the OBELI clue might be impenetrable.I was relieved enough to have this all correct.

    COD to ADVISEDLY for a rather elegant surface

    1. I also thought that this puzzle included a fair number of obscure and semi-obscure words for a Monday.
      Is semi-obscure a semi-obscure word?
  8. Unknown dinosaur, biffed TREDEGAR when had only the D and G as checkers. Took AIRS AND GRACES to fix that. SCAMMER, SHAMMER or SPAMMER – eventually plumped for the right one – I liked ATHENAEUM and RASCALDOM.
  9. 30 mins pre brekker.
    Mostly I liked: Itch=Union Problem etc. and Gorge.
    Thanks generous setter and Vinyl
  10. 21 minutes with only hitches in SE. I ventured CELESTA without conviction, which gave SHAMMER as more than a possibility, and then it had to be LOI RASCALDOM. The last of the children finally leaves home in half an hour to live with his girlfriend. Now to play the role of gruff father making out that it’s just another day. Thank you V and setter.
    1. It is quite dusty in here. I keep getting something in my eye, too. I’m sure it’ll clear up later.
      1. Ten years after the empty nest, I have finally boxed up the now 29-year-old’s things on the grounds that she now has a house of her own, but cannot yet bring myself to tell her.
    3. My 41 and 39 year olds’ toys have accommodated the grand-kids and are now awaiting the great grand-kids 🙂
  11. RASCALDOM and SHAMMER my LOIs. No real problems. A few of the chestnuts (OBELI, LIANA, TITANIA etc.) made this a gentle Monday.
  12. 11:18 despite 2 interruptions. Very Mondayish indeed. RASCALDOM my LOI and I failed to parse CARDIGAN. I liked the elves of Ur.
  13. Nice steady 17.20 today; wasted a bit of time on ‘scammer’ and ‘spammer’ before finally hitting on ‘shammer’. Thanks V for explanation of 16d which I got but couldn’t justify.
    On another note, is there a Championship this year? If so, have I somehow missed all the entry puzzles? Or are they yet to come?

    Edited at 2019-07-01 08:13 am (UTC)

    1. Found this in the Club, posted by the Puzzles Editor in May: Thanks for your query. Don’t worry – you haven’t missed anything as yet. As mentioned earlier, we are planning some changes to the process this year. Bear with us – I will be making an announcement here in due course…

      Nothing since that I can see.

        1. I chased up on the Club forum last week. It’s looking like late November according to David Parfitt.
  14. Feeling pretty dreadful this morning, and that’s reflected in my 59 minutes (including some nodding-off time) with an unfortunate “SCAMMER” going in last. Bah. Hopefully my mood and my times will both improve as the week goes on!

    From what I’ve seen in Bristol, DRAGON boats typically don’t have sails, but yachts typically do, but at living here helped me with the nearby Cheddar GORGE-related answer. Though it’s one of those places that I keep meaning to visit but will probably die without seeing…

    Edited at 2019-07-01 08:13 am (UTC)

  15. Not quite a Monday for me, as I came in just under 19 minutes. That dinosaur wouldn’t pass register in my grandsons’ encyclopaedic knowledge, so “well known” I dispute. It doesn’t help that Tyrannosaurus fits the space and half the wordplay.
    A dragon boat I have raced in (we came second, and I still have the medal), but it’s not a yacht. These are!
    I also dallied over LOI SHAMMER because SCAMMER is a much more immediate answer and hard to shake even to satisfy the wordplay. Though it was good to see India cammered for once by England yesterday.
    1. Yep, I was just about to reply to Matt (and, I see, vinyl), to say that the clue surely points to the former Olympic class racing yacht. It’s a keel vessel, which I think makes it a yacht, where dragon boats are officially a form of canoe, albeit big ones!
  16. Mostly Mondayish, held up at the end because I’d put in CELESTE with an E so took a while to see the LOI 28a. 24 minutes, should have been faster. Good time, V. Good blog, vinyl1.
  17. Like Pip, I biffed CELESTE, but quickly changed it on re-reading the wordplay. I also put in SCAMMER, but couldn’t parse it and then saw SHAMMER, my penultimate entry. My LOI, RASCALDOM, took a multi alphabet trawl as I was convinced the definition was burn for ages. GORGE was a write in, as my younger daughter lives in Cheddar and her garden is a series of tiers hewn into the Gorge itself. DADAIST was my FOI followed by DRAGON. Fortunately I don’t know enough about boats to draw a distinction between types. NHO ATLANTOSAURUS, but the wordplay was kind. Didn’t manage to parse CARDIGAN. Nice puzzle. 26:20. Thanks setter and Vinyl.
  18. 12:20. Straightforward but not the easiest.
    I was sure that the Welsh town was going to start CAM.
    RASCALDOM is a funny word.
    Pleased with myself for spelling NEMESIS right for once.
  21. 17’05, steady jog. Not quite convinced about graces and decorations. (Grace-notes?) Word of the day, rascaldom.
  22. Sub-15, had to take care with CELESTA, SHAMMER and the unknown (as opposed to well-known) dinosaur. Rather liked 16d CARDIGAN, for its wordplay and allusion also to the commander of the Light Brigade.

    My father always found the clue “Eat too much Cheddar, perhaps?”, highly amusing and used to quote it a lot – it may be that he didn’t do many cryptic crosswords.

    By judicious choice of submission (but absolutely no cheating) I am currently 48th in the cryptic table.

    Thanks vinyl and setter.

    Edited at 2019-07-01 10:33 am (UTC)

  23. Straightforward. No time, as I was listening to the radio while solving. Still got the Russian newsfeed thingy at the bottom of the screen 🙁

    1. I’m another who is now plagued by endless Russian news scrolling thing at the bottom of my screen. Seems to be linked to ‘Ratings’ and I can’t get rid of it.

      Any ideas/help out there?

      Re xword: a decent Monday for me but stupid biff of SCAMMER and not checking WP meant a DNF for me.
      Thanks setter and Vinyl

      1. Depends which browser you’re using, but an ad blocking browser extension — AdBlock Plus is the most popular (and free) — gets rid of irritants like that.

        1. Thanks for responding. I use FireFox and have Adblockers so this shouldn’t have got through. Now that it has, can’t seem to shift it.
          1. hm. I’ve heard people say that sometimes uninstalling and reinstalling adblockers fixes these things, but obviously no guarantees. I’m currently using one called uBlock on Safari and it works fine, for what its worth.

            1. Thanks again. Think I’m going to have to wait until there’s s’one more competent than I nearby before I start mucking about with the settings. Just have to train myself to ignore it for now!
  24. I was relieved to find today’s relatively straightforward – I was beginning to suspect that my second neuron had packed up, after struggling with the last few puzzles. However, I now see that everyone else found it easy too, which means I still don’t have reliable data.

    In any event, this one was closed up and off to resus in twenty-four minutes. Everything seemed fairly straightforward, although for some reason it took me a long time to see DISREPAIR.

  25. This would have been a quickie for me but I actually had to put in some thinking to get the dinosaur and I’d started off with “tunnelled” (yes I know) in 4D. Eons ago I went on a school visit to Cheddar Gorge and Wookey Hole – ate the packed lunch on the bus right after breakfast. The juxtaposition of the seven-year itch and the homily in the old marriage service about entering into matrimony soberly and ADVISEDLY etc was nice. 12.13
  28. In recent day I’ve been getting Russian stuff at the bottom of the page. The search facility isn’t working for me either, just telling me nothing’s been found and taking me to some Russian page.

    Anyone know what’s going on?

  29. ….then is ANTONY,M the ANTONYM of Caesar,J ?

    NHO ATLANTOSAURUS, and like Kevin Gregg I put the T at the beginning, this leaving 2D in a state of DISREPAIR.

    I actually put the pen down with the stopwatch showing 9:11 but then went back to consider my two biffs. CELESTA was nailed almost immediately, and only then did I correct “scammer”.

    FOI DRAGON (I’d entered the D and T of DADAIST)
    LOI SHAMMER (it was LOI when it was wrong anyway)
    COD CARDIGAN
    TIME Just over 10 minutes.

  30. Fell for the Tyrannosaurus trap, and lost precious minutes wondering why on earth I couldn’t solve 2 and 3 down. I assume it was a deliberate trap, so full marks to setter!
  31. 14:32 so not too hard but not too Mondayish either. Had to biff the town as I couldn’t spot the join between eccentric and leader so Wigan remained shrouded in mist rolling in along the pier.
  33. Have been to Preston today and solved my LOI Cardigan as we went through Wigan. And I did not get the parsing until reading this! Thank you blogger. David
  34. 16:21. Nice n’ Monday-ish with some quirky vocab thrown in to keep it interesting.
    1. like RASCALDOM… I dunno about you guys – but I saw rascal pretty early from the checked letters (+scallywags) but it ended up being one of the last words I got… due to the unusual suffixtery 😉
  35. I’m rather new to this, but I think perhaps your parsing of 12ac is a bit off (but it’s the same way I initially saw it)…

    you have it as:
    ATHENAEUM – A + THEN + A(E.U)M.

    but I think perhaps a more accurate reading would be:
    (A(THEN)(A)(EU)M)
    ie the first and the last letter (AM) is ‘American’, “that time” is THEN (where ‘at that time’ means put the next bit at the spot where ‘that time’ finishes’. and the rest of course is as you said.

    Apologies if that’s what you meant and I misconstrued – or if indeed I am simply wrong and wasted everyone’s time 😉

    LET’S MAKE AMERICA GETEU AGAIN!

    Edited at 2019-08-02 12:18 pm (UTC)

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