Times 24482 – my kingdom for a harmonica player?

Author   glhPosted on Categories Daily Cryptic
Solving time : Did not finish! I am completely and utterly stuck on 3 down and I’m going to feel silly soon. This was overall a pretty frustrating experience, I got a phone call less than a minute in which resulted in being waylaid for a few hours, and coming back to this around midnight, accompanied by having to explain every clue to a friend of mine, who remarked that most of the exercise was “stupid”. But it is I who stand supreme in denseness – I may come up with a satisfactory answer to this by the end of the blog, but right now I’m sitting on 5 hours with one empty space. And not only that, but I’m using a friend’s computer and it put the white space of doom in this blog (hopefully gone by the time you read this). Not my day…

Several hours and some sleep later, it looks like this was a tough one, and I have one mistake. I should have gotten 3d.

Across
1 HARD, LEFT: Got the HARD part before the LEFT part
5 BYPASS: P(igg)Y reversed in BASS
8 NOD: DON reversed
9 DINNER LADY: cryptic definition
10 OLIVE OYL: anagram of O,O (loves), and LIVELY
11 ALEXIS: A, XI’S around LE(ft)
12 C,LOG
14 DARWINISTS: I’S after WIN in DARTS – loved this clue, particularly the well-hidden definition
17 BUTTERMILK: UTTER in BM(?) then ILK. I don’t have Bradfords or Chambers here so I can’t figure out the BM part, but I don’t think it can be anything else from the definition. Edit: see comments, I was not on form today… BUT,TERM,ILK
20 KALI: Hidden reversed, Hindu goddess
23 ATRIUM: U in A,TRIM
24 K,OWT,OWED: got this from the definition
25 RED CABBAGE: got this from the definition and checking letters, but the wordplay is superb – A,CD in E, GABBER all reversed
26 deliberately omitted
27 deliberately omitted
28 PREDATOR: PREDAT(e), OR
 
Down
1 HANSOM CAB: anagram of BACON and MASH
2 deliberately omitted
3 help!!! I’ve put LEDGER in my grid, but I don’t think it’s right Edit: see numerous comments on LADLER. Apparently I’m the only person on the planet to not have known Larry Adler. Sorry to the whole Adler family.
4 FUNNY(a scream),F,ARM
5 BIRYANI: IN, AY, RIB all reversed. And here’s my mistake, BIR,IA,NI, never seen this spelling before, but it makes more sense with the wordplay
6 PLACE KICK: from the definition, I’m not sure of the wordplay here either
7 STY,LIST: I like LIST as paper for shopper
13 deliberately omitted
15 WALK ON, AIR
16 SKIN DIVER: another nice definition (one not going to bed in suit) – wordplay is S, then I,V in KINDER
18 UTTER,ER: did a double-take seeing the two UTTER components crossing each other
19 RUM,MAGE
21 AT WORST: A TWO then R(e)ST
22 ATTEND: T,T (times) in A,END

51 comments on “Times 24482 – my kingdom for a harmonica player?”

  1. George, at 3dn I think LADLER is the “spooner” and the harmonica player’s partly abbreviated name being L(arry) ADLER
  2. Can a benchmark be construed as a bar?

    This puzzle proved too tricky for me in my allotted hour. It’s days like this when this blog is particularly welcome!

  4. Very testing, happy to get through without aids. Just don’t ask the time. Some very clever clues; my pick of the bunch was probably DARWINISTS.

    At 5dn I had BIRIANI, figuring that A1 was “cracking”.

  6. With richnorth on 5D and Paul S. on 17.

    14:40, a minute or two of which was my fault – rushing DARWINIANS at 14 despite wondering what happened to the end of DARTS. Plenty of others written in without full understanding, like 25.

    COD to 3D for making Spooner mean something else.

  7. 50 minutes when I ran out of time with two unresolved at 22dn and 24ac. I had ATTEND in mind for 22dn but it didn’t fit with the ideas I was fixated on at 24ac so it didn’t go in. If I’d had more confidence and written it I might have spotted KOWTOWED eventually but as things were I was left trying to explain BORROWED at 24ac with several elements of the clue conflicting in my mind: showed deference = bowed, due = owed, or = or, king = the other R, but they didn’t fit together in the right order, I had no explanation of the B nor a definition for borrowed that fitted any of it.

    But it was certainly a very lively puzzle which I really enjoyed until the setter beat me at the final hurdle.

  8. Too tough for me. Had to go for the aids to finish in 50 min. Some hugely devious an misleading surfaces, but all very clever. Is Anax back?
  9. 3 down is LADLER, ie Spooner – as in (L)arry Adler – harmonica player who regularly appeared on Morecambe & Wise (but was barely allowed to play one note by them)
  10. From Wikipedia –

    Lawrence “Larry” Cecil Adler (February 10, 1914 – August 7, 2001) was an American musician, widely acknowledged as one of the world’s most skilled harmonica players. Composers such as Ralph Vaughan Williams, Malcolm Arnold, Darius Milhaud and Arthur Benjamin composed works for him. During the later stage of his career he was known for his collaborations with popular musicians Sting, Elton John, Kate Bush, and Cerys Matthews.

  11. See reference above. I may have got the Morecambe & Wise reference wrong, but Adler was a harmonica player, and someone who ladles something is a spooner.
    1. Sorry, we didn’t make it clear that the only thing we disagreed with was the Morecambe and Wise part – Larry Adler was already identified in the first comment, from kurihan2, so any disagreement about that should have happened before.
  12. This one had a long tail. There was tricky wordplay for buttermilk, skin diver and Alexis.
    There was also a tricky separation in Charles I’s. I finished with 22 where I could not see the definition. I had to go away and forget the clue and then come back and look at the checked letter pattern when I immediately saw attend.

    I loved the misdirection of Spooner at 3. I also liked Olive Oyl. Anyone not knowing the correct spelling of her surname would have had trouble with funny farm. That reminds me, funny farm is a bit too non-PC for my taste.

  13. Misspelling at first OLIVE OYL (OIL) made this even tougher than it should have been. Persevered way beyond my usual cut-off time simply because of the sheer delight as such clues as BYPASS, DINNER LADY, KOWTOWED and DARWINISTS slowly fell. Wonderful stuff. Cheers to setter.
  14. i finished 3/4 of this before resorting to aids, and felt i had done well to get that far. a few months ago it would have been largely blank. lots of clever constructions but maybe cod 14ac.
  15. I tackled this with a pincer movement advancing slowly on two fronts from the southeast and northwest. When cut off, the southwest offered stiff resistance but that was nothing compared to the bloody seige of the northeast which extended the war onsiderably. A Pyrrhic victory – lucky to get through it in one piece.

    Nick

  16. Longest time for ages at 39 mins, with the NE corner taking half the time on its own. I’m with Paul S and Peter: it has to be BIRIANI (in A1 rib reversed) but because I got so chewed up with BYPASS, that was last in. Some fabulous misdirections, especially DARWINISTS, PREDATOR, STYLIST and that barking dog had me convinced that half the rest of the clues were even more devious than they appeared. I spent quite a while trying to make Cavaliers fit clue and light at 14, but it stubbornly refused. Brilliant, if hard on the little grey cells.
    PS everything you need to know about the harmonica player on Morcambe and Wise is here http://www.morecambeandwise.com/viewpage.aspx?pageid=266
  17. Sorry Peter, I see, rather too late, that your link and mine are the same. Must work out how to put links in more concisely!
    1. Don’t worry – if you type (or better, paste in) a URL, LiveJournal recognises it and turns it into a link. For a link using different text, the syntax is: <a href=”URL”>LINKTEXT</a>

      So if the comment you type contains:

      the Times blog is <a href=”http://community.livejournal.com/times_xwd_times“>here</a>
      (except the underlining) then you’ll get this:

      the Times blog is here

      You must get the angle brackets and everything between them in exactly the right place – it’s a good idea to test any link by using the Preview options.

  18. Larry Adler for me will always be the music behind Genevieve, which he both composed and played.
  19. After yesterday’s KO victory I suffered two black eyes and a bloodied nose today. Had to make gratuitous use of aids to get anywhere near the finishing line and even then the NE corner remained blank. Wonderful clues abounded, most too devious by half for me (eg BYPASS, DARWINISTS, SKIN DIVER). This puzzle is definitely one to file and re-try in a few months to see if my solving has improved.

    Setter 1 – 0 Daniel

  20. I put SENIOR LADY at 9, which made the harmonica player Lazy LESTER, even though he’s not dead and only remotely connected to the rest of the clue – via in TER(m). Ironically, Larry was the first harmonica player I thought of and “one who spoons” was the second “spooner” I thought of. If only I had thought of both those things simultaneously. Anyway, google soon sorted me out (by not having any reference to senior ladies in connection with schools).

    As for the rest, it was indeed a struggle, but a worthwhile one. Full marks to the setter. COD’s all over the show.

    And speaking of red cabbages and harmonica players, George, is that you under the hat by any chance?

      1. Well, I don’t know about lazy, but you certainly look fatigued (boom! boom!)
  21. 23:52 .. Dammit, this is a clever puzzle. I purred like a cat on a warm hearth throughout the solving of it. Sobering that all this ingenuity will wrap tomorrow’s fish and chips (do they still do that?).

    COD? LADLER, defintely LADLER. Or DARWINISTS. Or NOD, or BYPASS. Or STYLIST. A brilliant concoction. My compliments to the chef.

  22. Some very clever and imaginative stuff in this puzzle. Brilliantly well disguised definitions – e.g ATTEND, LADLER, and the KICK bit of PLACE KICK – and DARWINISTS which combined a well-hidden definition with a signpost to the wrong Charles. Like Barry, I initially entered OLIVE OIL at 10ac, which didn’t help. I’m with those who think it has to be BIRIANI at 5dn for the wordplay to work. Chambers is no help but the COED offers BIRIANI as an alternative spelling to BIRIYANI and BIRYANI. I finished correctly in the end but only with resort to aids for the last two or three clues.

  23. Forgot to say that my very first thought on seeing Spooner and harmonica player was that the answer might be ADDLER, an agent noun that might well define Mr S. I was sorry when the remainder of the clue disproved this theory but I wasn’t disappointed when the correct answer dawned on me.
  24. I filled most of this in 25 minutes, but was left with 5ac, 5dn, 6dn and 11 in the NE corner. I assumed the second word of 6dn was KICK but in the end I had to consult a dictionary to get the whole answer, which meant little to me. Once that was in I got BYPASS and the rest.

    There some very tricky and clever clues, with some of the definitions being difficult to spot. It was good to see some popular culture appear 12 (The Times moving with the times?). My only complaint was the tasteless inclusion of 4 in the grid. Mental illness is no matter for amusement.

    1. I can see words in the clue tempting you towards the Arry Ladler idea, but I don’t think it’s there – “partly abbreviated” is pushed into “Spooner’s name for harmonica player”, which could give you the two words, in a way that I can imagine unorthodox setters getting away with on some papers, but not the Times. Even then, “partly abbreviated” seems unnecessarily complex for what amounts to “part of” as an instruction to drop the Arry part.
  26. Updated the blog with all the suggestions from the comments. I was racing sleep and “when are you going to be finished with that stupid crossword thing” to get it all done, so not the usual standard.

    I never considered BIRIANI, I’d only seen it spelled with a Y, and I thought there was something funny with the wordplay, but at 1am it sounded just fine. I did a bosh of the wordplay in BUTTERMILK (I suspect most got it from definition too). Didn’t even cross my mind to have Spooner as a definition, so that counts as a definite win for the setter.

  27. My idea of a good Saturday puzzle but a bit strenuous after 18 holes and the usual dalliance in the 19th. I wont repeat what others have said – very good puzzle, wonderful definitions, 30 minutes to solve.
  28. Is the answer BIRIANI or BIRYANI. I entered BIRIANI, as this contains A1 for cracking. Are both answers therefore acceptable? 53 minutes of dogged solving.
    1. Sounds like the masses like BIRIANI – I’ve put in an edit to the blog that I wasn’t right. I’ll put a strikethrough through my wrong answer to make it clear.
    2. … it has to be BIRIANI as A1 = top quality = “cracking”. AY only means ah/oh/alas, yes/indeed, ever/always – none of which matches “cracking”.
  29. I was thrilled to finish in 50 minutes. i thought that this was a wonderful puzzle. my Clue of the year to date is Darwinists-such a clever lift and seperate which took me an age to see. thought skin diver was kind of neat too

    all in all i was really pleased to finish in 50
    well done to the setter and tough luck on the blogger to draw this one

  30. Stumped by LADLER, where like George I desperately guessed LEDGER, as a player, and hoped that the rest of it was some Spoonerized name for a harmonica in the UK. Never heard of Mr. Adler, even though I see here he is an American. I started last night and left it with 6 or so unsolved, which I filled in this morning. Many here were lavish with praise for yesterday’s puzzle, but this one really takes the cake. An outstanding puzzle, with 10 or more clues that deserve an award. Thanks to the setter, and regards to everyone else.
  31. Nearly finished within the hour, but got stuck on top RH. What is a place kick? I’ve heard of a free kick and a penalty shot, but not this one.

    A very clever and different kind of crossword – a new setter?

    1. Place kicks happen in both brands of Rugby, Union and League, at the start of the game and in attempts to kick the ball over the bar and between the posts for a goal, either from a penalty or for a conversion after a try.
      Interestingly, it’s also part of American Football, so not too parochial this time. and indeed the specialised player is a Placekicker (all one word).
    2. ODE describes it as a kick made after the ball is placed on the ground, and says that this applies to American Football, Rugby and Soccer – both free kicks and penalties are therefore place kicks, as are corners, goal kicks and the kick-off.
      1. But a place kick in American football has nothing to do with a penalty (nor a tee for that matter, which is only used in a kick-off). Penalties only result in loss or gain of yards.

        …Robert

  32. No time but finished in the end with one mistake spelling ‘biryani’ the only way that occurred to me. COD to 14. It’s all been said already.
  33. Did it v. late last night after day in France and having read all the above understand why I took 30m but did complete it I now know successfully before sleep overcame me.
  34. Just did this in Book 18. Definitely the best crossword I’ve ever tried. I rarely finish the Times crossword – but I was so motivated by its ingenuity that I did finish this one, and with no aids. And I correctly parsed all but two (17 and 18). OK, so it took a few (very enjoyable) hours.

    Very well done setter

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