QC 2963 by Beck

Plenty of hiddens today, some very contemporary GK and a pink square.  15:23 for me

Definitions underlined in bold , synonyms in (parentheses) (Abc)* indicating anagram of Abc, other wordplay in [square brackets] and deletions in {curly} brackets.

Across
1 Have no mercy hiding spitefulness (5)
VENOM – Hidden in “Have no mercy”
4 Pop singer’s praise set back International Publishers’ Association (3,4)
DUA LIPA – LAUD (praise) reversed + IPA

I very vaguely heard this name, and it turns out to be her real name (NÉE), of Kosovo/Albanian heritage. I have no problem with GK like this.

8 Enthusiastic approval of profit and loss review by accountant (7)
PLAUDIT – P&L (Profit & Loss) + AUDIT (review by accountant)

Don’t often see abbreviations where the & is dropped, but this is a new one, and works well with accountant for a clean surface.

9 Praise bygone tax deducting just one pound (5)
EXTOL – EX-TOLL (bygone tax) – L (one pound)

I though the bygone tax was going to be “tithe”.

10 Leave feeling excitement for just a moment (10)
FLEETINGLY – FLEE (Leave) = TINGLY (feeling excitement)

I got this by guessing that “feeling” must be part of an anagram.

14 Man strayed to the west (6)
DENNIS – SINNED (strayed) reversed [to the west]

Trick here was to assume that “strayed” probably ended in -ed, so need a name starting DE, hence DENNIS.

15 Child attending a part of recital (6)
SONATA – SON (child) + AT (attending) + A
17 Favourite source of personal recommendation (10)
PREFERENCE – P{personal} [source of] + REFERENCE (recommendation)
20 Statesman from Isle of Wight area, close to Sandown (5)
IOWAN – IOW + A{rea} + {Sandow}N

Statesman for “someone from the state of Iowa”, I liked this. IOW is more commonly seen in Email-speak as “In other Words”, IMHO.

22 Dean set off for area of London (4,3)
EAST END – (DEAN SET)* [off]
23 They let off steam”, blokes said (7)
GEYSERS – Sounds like GEEZERS (blokes)

As in a recent puzzle I tried to get GUVNORS to work before remembering that a governor on a steam engine controls the speed, it’s the safety valve that lets off steam.

Blokes regulate the speed, they say (7) is the clue I tried to answer.

24 Rather eccentric nickname for a girl (5)
DOTTY – Double def

I looked up famous people called Dotty and there really aren’t any, not spelt this way, any way.

Down
1 Enjoy an e-cigarette with clumsy fellow after 5 (4)
VAPE – APE (clumsy fellow) follows V(five)
2 Awesome element of drone attack (4)
NEAT – hidden in “drone attack”

Neat=awesome is a good pairing, with the same connotation of breathless teen-speak.

3 Pop singer tucking into Beck’s cake (9)
MADELEINE – ADELE (singer) hidden in MINE (Beck’s, where Beck is the setter)

With the checkers of M-D I tried to misspell MADDONNA to fit. Interesting self-reference to Beck here, I don’t think I have seen that before. And in some of the on-line Times versions the setter’s name doesn’t appear, if this affected you, you have my sympathy.

4 Changing one or the other initially to show hesitation (6)
DITHEREITHER (one or the other) [Changing initially]

I think this is the correct parsing, with the instruction to just change the initial letter, but no clue as to what. Why not ZITHER?

5 Cut taxes without limits (3)
AXE – {t}AXE{s}
6 Complete rearrangement of triangle (8)
INTEGRAL – (TRIANGLE)*

I kept seeing RELATING. This well known set also yields ALERTING and ALTERING. The clue would have been more head-scratching as “Complete altering of triangle (8)”

7 Cry about being trapped in distant back street (8)
ALLEYWAY – YELL (Cry) reversed and contained in AWAY (distant)

This was my LOI, I saw WAY=street, with “cry” as the definition and “back” as a reversal.

11 Plastic on sidecar coated with metal (4-5)
IRON-CASED – (ON SIDECAR)* [plastic]

Not in collins, or chambers. But the OED has lots of references, for example when referring to HMS Warrior. “Iron Clad” seems to be the preferred usage now, certainly in metaphors.

Plastic is a new anagram indicator for me, but it literally means “malleable”, and did so for hundred of years until the 1900s when synthetic products made from oil derivatives were so described. Now it is rarely used in the original sense, hence it confused me today.

12 Modifying giant pad in an unusual way (8)
ADAPTING – (GIANT PAD)*
13 Started directly below track (8)
UNDERWAY –  UNDER (directly below) + WAY (track)

Not sure what the “directly” is doing here, surface doesn’t need it, so must be part of the definition for “under”?

16 Heartless, reckless pause in proceedings (6)
RECESS – REC{kl}ESS [heartless]
18 Mailed out in absentia (4)
SENT – Hidden in absentia
19 Nervous editor going crazy ultimately (4)
EDGY – ED (editor) + {goin}G + {craz}Y
21 Once-called dictator’s opposing vote (3)
NÉE – sounds like NAY (opposing vote)

The source of my pink square, as the only word I could get to fit was NOE, which is what the Speaker says when he says “The Noes have it”, who are the opposing votes. I thought “Noh” could have been a Vietnamese Dictator. It turns out there is a Malaysian politician called Noh, but I don’t think he makes the dictator ranks.

NÉE is the term that married women use to refer to their maiden name, hence “once-called”. My son-in-law was rare in having to use NÉ, since he took his wife’s name. Good lad.

99 comments on “QC 2963 by Beck”

  1. I can hardly believe I needed 27 minutes to complete this – one of my longest ever solving times for a QC, but at least I persevered and got there in the end unlike a few previous occasions when I cut my losses and gave up.

    I have never heard of the singer at 4ac and needed all the checkers before seeing the wordplay that made the answer inevitable.

    I’m not sure whether PL (which doesn’t appear to exist in its own right) for P&L at 8ac is acceptable practice. It seems a bit dodgy to me.

    I felt 15ac needed a question mark.

    I couldn’t make any sense of the wordplay for DITHER, so thanks for coming up with ‘either’, Merlin. I think in a QC clue it would have been kinder to indicate the substitution more specifically. ZITHER doesn’t have the relevant meaning.

    My printed edition of Chambers has IRON-CASED, but it’s not a term I’ve ever met before (only “iron-clad”). Whilst researching this I found an OED entry which advised IRON-CASED occurs fewer than 0.01 occasions per million words in modern English. Perfect for inclusion in a QC then!

    Like Merlin I started with NOE at 21dn but later went back to review it and realised NÉE was the correct answer.

    There was a “Dotty” Cotton in Eastenders, granddaughter of the legendary “Dot” Cotton. Her real name was “Kirsty”.

    1. I think PL is just about acceptable for P&L. Balance Sheet is often shortened to BS.

      1. My view is that abbreviations need to be in one of the three specified dictionaries. I don’t have time to check on BS for Balance Sheet at the moment (although I’m certain what I would find!) but PL without the ampersand isn’t. The query is really whether omitting the ampersand makes it valid in a crossword where grids are not designed to cater for punctuation and symbols, and I can’t make up my mind about that.

    2. Isn’t there a Dotty Attie? She is an “acclaimed feminist painter” as per thefreedictionary.com

  2. 14:41 Went quickly right up to UNDERWAY and IOWAN which foiled me for quite a few minutes.

  3. Wow! Bit of a struggle today as seems to be the case with others. I finished this but it took a while and was left with questions on some of the parsings. DITHER it had to be but didn’t see the connection to ‘either’, thanks M. ALLEYWAY went in after a few checkers but didn’t agree with distant/away but maybe it’s supposed to mean away as in ‘dreaming’.

    DUA LIPA went in immediately, not that I could name a song by the artist. MADELEINE. took a while to see but I have to agree with Merlin and wonder why it’s not possible to show the setter’s name on all versions of the crossword, given that without it this particular clue might be impossible. Liked IOWAN and DENNIS when I saw what was going on. IRON-CASED was new to me but gettable from the anagrist.

    Thanks Merlin and setter.

  4. Hugely cheered, as I read the comments before me, to find I am not alone in finding this a struggle. I could almost cut-and-paste Jack’s comment, as I too NHO the singer at 4A (but the wordplay was kind), could not make progress with DITHER until the D checker appeared, DK IRON-CASED as a phrase, and started with NoE for NÉE.

    I solve on a phone so the reference to Beck in the clue for MADELEINE meant nothing (note to our esteemed crossword editor – can we please please ban this sort of clue until the app is fixed), but fortunately with the checkers the answer appeared readily enough. And I wonder how the homophone for GEYSERS will work for all – I pronounce the gusher as “geezer”, but I believe not all do.

    All in, a slow and at times somewhat tortuous solve, taking 19:02. Many thanks Merlin for guiding us through it.

        1. Except maybe Oink? We’d lose a lot of fun without our regular pork based puns.

    1. Don’t know if its my Canadian mother or what but I definitely pronounce GEYSER as “guys er” not “geezer” so I was a little confused but it was the only word I could think of which fit the checking letters I had.

    2. Try rotating phone 90 degrees. If you play on a browser then name appears. Not sure about app

  5. A tough challenge from the late Jeff but thoroughly enjoyable. 14.28 for me, with PLAUDIT my LOI. Merlin I think at 8ac the ‘audit’ part is ‘review by accountant’. I was fooled by several, including the statesman, MADELEINE (I thought it was going to end in Y) and the expression IRON CASED. Toll a bygone tax? Not around here it ain’t. Thanks to both.

  6. I’m surprised people haven’t heard of Dua Lipa, one of the more famous musicians worldwide (goes to show how out-dated most QC GK really is).
    I found this very tough, a few gimmes and a lot of tricky clues with a few too many extraneous words that didn’t actual contribute to the clue.
    I don’t like self-references while some solving methods don’t show the setters name (and I don’t think they make the clues any better anyway).

    1. Or how out-dated some of us QC solvers are? At least today she was clued more generously than when she turned up in a puzzle last October defined as ‘Glastonbury star’ on the strength of two appearances there 7 years apart. Anyway despite that, I still didn’t know her, nor shall I next time probably.

    2. I tend to agree about setter’s names, but sometimes it can improve the surface – as Beck is an American singer-songwriter (best known for his 1991 hit Loser), it does here. If you get the reference, at least.

      App solvers are short-changed by not being able to see the setter’s name, and until that’s fixed, setters should refrain from self-references.

    3. If you had to name 3 Dua Lipa songs would you be able to? I’d struggle to name more than “that one with Elton John”!

      1. I struggle to name 3 songs by the Rolling Stones, The Who or Pink Floyd but I know of them! I was born around the time they were big but we never had their music on in our household

    4. I thought she might be one of those “women who launch” who was on that rocket yesterday.

    5. Agree on both counts. I do the QC on my phone (which does not display setter) on the way to work for… The Times, and so am well placed to complain..!

  7. I don’t think I’ve worked back to the setter’s name from a cake before. Thanks Merlin. Slow biff baff boff.

  8. Anyone else still very disappointed that (android user) the setters name does not appear in The Time app version of the puzzle despite numerous grumbles over the years I have been following this blog. That my friends made Madeleine very tough until all the checkers took other cakes off the menu. Put in with a sigh at my lack of GK regarding the Beck mining industry…
    …I seem to recall someone explaining how getting the setters name into the puzzle section of the app would be as difficult as putting five middle aged women into an iron cased phallus and blasting them into space…
    Thanks Merlin and Mine
    25:43 btw

  9. Very tough for a rare DNF. NHO Dua Lipa and couldn’t come up with laud so that was that!

    No idea on time as break in the middle but close to an hour when we gave up! Fleetingly took forever.

    Thanks Merlin for the much needed blog, btw you have a typo in 21d I think you mean NAY not NAT 😊

  10. I got there in 23 mins. DITHER held me up a bit. Tricky, but actually quite enjoyable in the end. It helped that I like Dua Lipa as a singer, and that for decades it has tickled me that DENNIS fire engines spelled sinned in reverse.

    Pi ❤️

  11. Tough going.

    Very vaguely heard of DUA LIPA but the ‘IPA’ pointed me in the right direction, NHO of IRON CASED but it was kindly clued and, unlike our blogger, I really disliked IOWAN, as I did last time it came up.
    Nearly ended up with a DPS but my I picked up ‘nae’ on my read through.

    Started with EXTOL and finished with MADELEINE in 11.35, although not everything was fully parsed, with COD to FLEETINGLY.

    Thanks to Merlin for the much needed blog and Beck for the enjoyable workout.

  12. Slow to get going but once things picked up it all fell into place after 45 minutes.
    Didn’t understand NEE but thanks to Merlin it makes sense now and was a very good clue requiring a sideways look at ‘dictatorial’ and ‘once-called’
    Assumed Beck was a diamond mine I’d never heard of after biffing Madeleine. At least I’d heard of Adele unlike Dua Lipa (but fairly clued)
    Thanks both.

  13. I’d always believed “under way” to be two words, although it seems that, not for the first time, I’m out of date and “underway” is now acceptable

    1. Both ‘underway’ and ‘under way’ are in the usual dictionaries although ODE appears to favour two words and the others give prominence to one. There’s also ‘under weigh’ with specific reference to ships which some sources don’t list or classify as archaic.

  14. I really enjoyed this one. Madeleine was a neat clue for those who could read the setter’s name. Trying to be as objective as possible, it seems fair enough to include Dua Lipa, a huge global star, in the kind of GK a solver might be expected to possess. 14:52 after about 2 minutes spent on LOI sonata. Kept thinking the child must be tot.

  15. Just into the SCC, having spent time at the end glaring at N-E and debating which vowel to insert. I’ve written NEE but if I’ve ever said it I think I would have made it rhyme with bee, and not noticed anyone else’s pronunciation otherwise.
    Liked the FLEE TINGLY, and the naughty DENNIS who I assume must be not uncommon in Crosswordland but was new to me.
    Hurrah! Singers who are not dead and whose songs I can sing – ok, hum quietly.
    Thanks to Beck, and to Merlin.

  16. Tough even though there were lots of easy write-ins on an early walk around the grid.
    I shared many of the difficulties mentioned above but got there in 24.11 after a few biffs and stumbles. The contrast in difficulty between, say, AXE and MADELEINE (a biffed cake for me – not parsed) made for a strangely unsatisfying puzzle. Some enjoyable moments but not enough.
    Note. I found myself wasting time on POLL (tax) for the bygone tax and on Posh and Becks in 3d.
    Thanks, all.

  17. 19:56 for the solve. Glad to see others saying this was a struggle. Felt pushed by needing to come up with versions of “praise” three times in the first four clues and this was the area where I struggled. Looking back the issue seems to be figuring out what parts of clues applied where.

    Have heard of Dua Lipa – one of modern music’s reasonably decent acts along with Adele. Despite my struggles I rather enjoyed clues like IOWAN, UNDERWAY, FLEE-TINGLY – so thanks to Beck.

    Interesting note to self that I couldn’t parse VAPE because I completely missed the 5 as it was next to the (4). Also thanks to Merlin for decoding that and DITHER.

  18. Some very obscure passings here, but managed to finish in 26:35 with fingers crossed. Heard of DUA LIPA, but not aware of any of her songs; got MADELEINE from the cake, not having thought of ADELE; IRON CASED and NEE were biffed.

  19. Blimey that was a toughie today! I eventually crossed the line in 14.05, which looking at some of the times posted doesn’t seem as bad as I first thought. It is however a DNF as I put in NAE for 21dn going all Glaswegian for some reason! My pop knowledge extends to knowing Adele and would even recognise her voice, but although I’ve heard the name DUA LIPA, I wouldn’t even been been able to tell you if it was a he or a she!

    1. Given the modern times, why are you limiting your options to a he or a she? 🤣

  20. DNF.
    Ruined my week after a good start yesterday. Just too difficult. Very disheartening.
    I could either try to learn from this monster or give up with these so called “Quick Cryptics” altogether.
    Not sure which of these I will do.

  21. Not on this wavelength at all – got most of it but even those full of question marks so thank you, Merlin, for sorting it all out. NHO profit & loss = PL; DENNIS, SONATA, ALLEYWAY, UNDERWAY just too difficult. And I share your pink square; so you mean “dictator” = “sounds like”? That is really difficult, too. As you say, surely the opposing vote is noe, not nay?

    1. No, that’d be a NO, not a NOE. Forgive me, but this sort of incorrect back-spelling from a plural reminds me of VP Dan Quayle’s insistence that POTATOE be spelt thus.

  22. A pretty unsatisfying puzzle, in that most of the answers were bifd, with the consequential struggle to parse them, which I failed to do with DITHER. Fortunately there was no other option. I understood that random names as answers were to be discouraged, yet here we have DENNIS. (Or was it random names as part of the wordplay?) DUA LIPA and Adele not a problem, though also bifd. Far too many hiddens and a MER at SONATA being referenced as part of a recital without a question mark.

    1. Sadly, as a founding member of the We Hate Names Club, it was only random names as part of the wordplay.

  23. Despite early misgivings at seeing ‘pop singer’ in two clues, it turns out I had heard of both, so no worries there. Contrary to many above contributors, I found this pretty straightforward, with some splendid clues.
    8:36 for a very enjoyable solve – thanks Beck, and Merlin

  24. Managed to solve todays just over 40 minutes. I solved on paper, and despite having Beck’s name right in front of me, took me ages to figure out how MINE meant Beck’s 😆 Thank you for the blog

  25. Another example of using the setters name within a clue (Beck’s / mine) when that setters name is not shown on the on-line view of the quick cryptic for those of us who solve in the times app. Really, really annoying!!!!

  26. As a phone solver I was sure David Beckham must be involved somehow … didn’t hold me up much though.

    What with NEAT, ADELE, DUA LIPA, and VAPE, this felt like me trying out on my godchildren the new words I’ve learned from the Guardian (to predictable eye-rolling effect – “Calm down gramps.”).

    Opted for proofreading today and that pushed me just over target, to 10:03 and an OK Day. MADLEINE was a fine clue if you could see the setter’s name and I also enjoyed SONATA and COD RECESS. Many thanks Beck and Merlin.

    1. Maybe you could get some Dua Lipa to play on your gramophone with its woofers and tweeters 🤣

  27. Walked away after 20mins, with quite a few gaps, but decided to give it another go after a calming cup of tea. Whittled away at the answers (. . .with a very blunt brain) until eventually down to my last two. Never even heard of Dua Lipa, and so could scarcely believe the cryptic. Loi Fleetingly (if only) then rubbed salt in the wound. One to forget. Invariant

  28. DNF multiples.
    Astonished to remember 4a Dua Lipa and even more astonished to find her absent from Cheating Machine. Must have forgotten to save it last time she came up.
    3d Madeleine. HHO Adele, not sure about the cake, missed it.
    11d Iron Cased, NHO, not added to CM as I doubt any other setter would use it. Ironclad is all one word as far as I can see, and is quite common. If the answer had been Iron-Clad I would have added it to CM as 2 words, but it wasn’t.
    This QC is IMHO quite unique. I might get used to this style, but not any time soon.
    Thanks to Merlin and Beck.

  29. 16.22 DNF. RECESS took a while and I spent ages on LOI 7d before biffing ALLEYCAT. A poor effort. Thanks Merlin and Beck.

  30. 8.48

    Unusual mixture of gimmes and toughies. The Beck thing passed me by but even if I had seen the setter’s name I would have assumed beck is some sort of mine (like Ian). LOI DITHER.

    Thanks Beck and another excellent blog. I too applaud your son-in-law – if I were marrying someone whose surname was Merlin I’d want a bit of that too

  31. I agree that this was on the more difficult end of the QC spectrum, but that’s fine by me. The cuppa was fairly cool by the time my LOI (DENNIS) went in. Needed the I from the crossing cake before I saw it.

    I have no complaint about the difficulty, though. It’s good for us to be stretched.

    Loved the thought of fleeing tingly

    Thanks very much Beck and Merlin

    .

  32. 8:57

    No problem with either of the global popstars. I have a feeling that Beck has referred to themselves in a previous grid – similar comments on not being able to see the setter’s name on the phone app ensued – surely this is a very simple thing to resolve?

    I was temporarily held up by the 3-letter 21d, but also had trouble understanding 4d – I bunged in EITHER before DUA LIPA corrected the first letter. I also had trouble remembering any of the many anagrams of triangle, at least until the first couple of checkers went in. I liked ALLEYWAY and LOI SONATA the most.

    Thanks Merlin and Beck

  33. DNF

    Threw in the towel after an hour with just under a third of the grid left blank – but I did know DUA LIPA 😀

    Thanks to Beck and especially Merlin for the enlightenment.

  34. Apologies to those of you who solve on the app for the MADELEINE clue. Setters have been told not to self-reference in clues (and I should have picked it up anyway). An updated version of the app should make the setter’s name available.

    1. The app updated yesterday but I still can’t see the setter’s name. ( android)

  35. 27 mins…

    A tough one this. Overall, I didn’t mind the “Dua Lipa” clue, but, whilst not my thing, I had heard of her at least. Got slightly frustrated at the name thing for 11ac (one my bugbears) and still not sure about 21dn “Nee”. Like many, I struggled with the parsing of 4dn “Dither”.

    FOI – 1ac “Venom”
    LOI – 15ac “Sonata”
    COD – 10ac “Fleetingly”

    Thanks as usual!

  36. Enjoyable. In a rush today so looked up cakes and saw MADELEINE. – bought some yesterday! Got DUA LIPA, amazingly.
    Liked FLEETINGLY, and many others.
    Thanks vm, Merlin. CNP some.

  37. A mix of very easy and rather tricky clues today. Didn’t parse MADELEINE until I saw Beck’s name in the title of the blog and the penny finally dropped. Didn’t get the significance of statesman in IOWAN and didn’t see the ‘5’ in the clue for VAPE at all. Held up by UNDERWAY and LOI RECESS. Liked FLEE TINGLY and NÉE. Don’t think I’ve ever seen né used before – brilliant! Thanks Merlin and Beck.

  38. Anything mentioning pop stars is a potential problem, although incredibly I’d heard of both as confirmed by grandchildren. IOWAN left incomplete

  39. Very tough. Didn’t get one until 20a. Finally finished on 37:37 (putting DUA LIPA into 8a instead of 4a didn’t help for a while) only to find I’d put NAE instead of NEE. If I was going to have a DNF, I suppose it might as well be one I’ve taken 37 minutes for anyway. Thanks Beck and Merlin.

  40. DNF
    Whizzed though in 19 mins but could not get 14across.
    Dua Lipa occurred recently so I had heard of her.
    I guessed Madeleine as Madonna did not fit and it was a cake. No setter’s name on the app so a total biff. A few others were biffed as well including nho iron- cased .

    No problems with IOW. It is the standard abbreviation. COD: FLEETINGLY

    Thanks for the helpful blog Merlin.

  41. 11m with t£po
    I almost saw Dua Lipa but was prevented (saved?) by the weather in Abu Dhabi.
    Last few were the cake and sonata.
    COD Dennis.

  42. I got the five easiest ones…

    Different pain meds fogging my brain a bit unfortunately.

  43. Off to a great start with VENOM, DUA LIPA and ADAPTING going straight in, thereby providing no fewer than 11 starting letters. However, only four of those (NEAT, AXE, INTEGRAL and IOWAN) were quickly used and it wasn’t long before I ground to a complete halt. Thereafter, it was a drawn-out struggle to the end, which I reached in around 38-39 minutes.

    Unfortunately, I forgot to revisit 21d, where I had tentatively written NaE (and a question mark), so I ended up with a DNF.

    My last few in were FLEETINGLY, the NHO MADELEINE cake and PREFERENCE, but I also doubted my answers to several other clues. Somehow, this QC didn’t feel right to me, I’m afraid.

    Many thanks to Merlin and Beck.

  44. 12:31. I didn’t especially like this puzzle, not least because of the singer (whom I’ve nothing against). I think it was trying to be too clever by half some of the time. but thank you both!

  45. SCC for me – this one was hard pounding. I entered DENNIS hesitantly from the checkers but couldn’t parse it: obvious now (thanks Merlin). Got DUA LIPA straight away and that suggested ALLEYWAY for 7d but I only parsed it after writing it down and then finding YELL going upwards. And so on. I think of Madeleines as little buns rather than a cake (pace Proust) but OK. My only error was NOE rather than NEE and I see I was in good company. Thanks Beck.

  46. DNF after 25 minutes. I thought I had once I entered IRON CASED (with a shrug) only to find when I came here that I had overlooked 16dn completely. I also had one error- I had NOE at 21dn. I think this just about works although NEE is clearly a better fit to the clue.

    FOI – 1ac VENOM
    LOI – DNF
    COD – 10ac FLEETINGLY. Liked DENNIS too.

    Thanks to Beck and Merlin.

  47. I had an ‘ooh’ moment when solving DUA LIPA. Whilst I know of her I reckoned many wouldn’t. I got MADELEINE from the definition. I could see it was ADELE in MINE but didn’t understand how MINE was related to a stream! My LOI was NEE and I couldn’t parse it. These many years I have been pronouncing it incorrectly as in ‘needle’. Thanks Merlin for your much needed blog today. 8:18

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