Times 29023 – Take it easy, either way…

83 comments on “Times 29023 – Take it easy, either way…”

1. 36:28, if I can complete, must be on the easy side.

   Good start with 1a where NSW seemed to be the only state that would fit.

   NHO SCAPEGRACE, and Scapegoat looked close but didn’t work. LOI BESTRIDDEN.
   Why is a parson an INCUMBENT? What happens if you get a new one, he can’t be the incumbent?

   COD SHEM

   1. I got it from wordplay, but the definition is in Collins: a member of the clergy holding a benefice

   2. Incumbent is a 19th-century thing. He is the holder of the benefice, as distinct from the curate who does the actual work in a rich living.

      1. It’s a 21st century thing too .. I live in a benefice of five churches, managed by an incumbent who is also a Rector, not a vicar ..

2. Scapegrace indeed. I’m still not sure I see Nitre – I wasn’t aware that NR could stand in for near or NRE for Near East. I found some of the ‘this follows that’ or ‘this inside that’ bits of the construction needed a second careful read to see clearly. Otherwise a blazingly fast start to the week for me.

   1. I struggled with that one as well, because I assumed Near East gave N…E and couldn’t see how to get any useful three letters from “it’s”. Then I remembered that NITRE is a component of gunpowder, and the penny dropped that Near East gave N..RE and that the filling was IT, not something derived from “it’s”

      1. I still don’t get it. How does Near East give N…RE?

         1. They’re separate clue parts. “Nr” is an abbreviation for “near” (in street addresses, it seems) and E is East as always.

            1. Thanks, Guy. NHO “nr”, and that was the only way the clue could work, but it’s not in the OED so I wrongly assumed it was made up. So much to learn. So much to learn.

3. Well, it was an easy Monday until I came to 25a BESTRIDDEN. I’m being a bit slow getting this, I just can’t get the parsing apart from study/den.

   1. RID(deliver), DEN(study) after BEST(worst, as in beat in battle)

      1. “It was the best of times, it was the worst of times”. Gotta love the English language. That was my thinking initially but wasn’t 100% sure. Thank you.

      2. I think we’ve since Best for Worst before (a good while ago).

4. 5:35 – pretty easy Monday fare though I got INCUMBENT from wordplay and biffed SCAPEGRACE

5. 13:01
   I biffed EMMENTHAL, only with one M and had to backtrack. (TH was changed to T in a spelling reform in Germany, so ‘thal’ (valley) became ‘tal’; so I imagine it’s Emmental now, although I don’t know if the Swiss adopted the reform. English-language scientific journals seem to vary between Neanderthal and Neandertal.) “Arkwright’s son” was cute, although I had a brain freeze and couldn’t remember the sons’ names; needed the S to remember.

   1. Well, Shem the Penman does appear in Finnegan’s Wake!

   2. Emmental it is, according to Wikipedia.

      1. Tanks.

   3. In Switzerland this cheese is called Emmentaler.

      1. O.E.D. gives Emmenthal as an alternative spelling of Emmental. I guess I must have encountered this in the past because I wrote it in happy that it was correct – also because the wordplay gave an ‘H’.

6. 18 minutes, held up at the end by having ‘scapegoats’, which almost works, the event being the Oaks (horse race). Eventually sorted things out when I cottoned on to who the Arkwright might be.

7. When I first saw Arkwright I was momentarily gripped by a sense of hopelessness until it dawned on me that we all know one person who built an ark, and only one. I was held up by some of the convoluted cryptics, quaint vocab and several interruptions to finish in a net 28-ish. An enjoyable puzzle and thanks V for several explanations.

   From High Water (For Charley Patton):
   Well George Lewes told the ENGLISHMAN, the Italian and the Jew
   Don’t open up your mind, boys, to every conceivable point of view.
   They got Charles Darwin trapped out there on Highway Five
   Judge says to the High Sheriff I want him dead or alive
   Either one of ’em, I don’t care…

   1. Two -Utnapishtim, but I don’t think we’re told of any of his children

8. Thanks to Vinyl1 and setter. Shouldn’t that be SH+E+M for 26ac (rather than SHE+M)?

   1. Indeed.

9. LOI BESTRIDDEN. All my last ones in were longer words. I was glad this didn’t hang me up too long, working after karaoke and a good bit of bourbon (but not—never!—enough to start shlurring my wordsh). Biffed two or three, including STRADIVARIUS.

   1. It wasn’t my LOI, but I was slow to get BESTRIDDEN; I tend to see bestriding as defending rather than dominating:
      Falstaff: Hal, if thou see me down in the battle and bestride me, so; ’tis a point of friendship.
      Prince: Nothing but a colossus can do thee that friendship.

      1. Cassius (talking about Julius Caesar in the eponymous play):
         Why, man, he doth bestride the narrow world
         Like a Colossus, and we petty men
         Walk under his huge legs and peep about
         To find ourselves dishonourable graves.

10. About 80 minutes extended greatly by accidentally putting two Ns instead of two Ts in 12A. This stopped me getting MEGALOMANIAC as there was no A crosser in 11D. The combination of long words made it harder. There is only one phrase where generally more of the long clues are phrases. NHO Arkwright as Noah, only as cotton spinning-frame inventor who had six sons. Reluctant to enter INCUMBENT since I couldn’t see a definition.

11. 26 minutes with the last 5 on BESTRIDDEN (only from wordplay) and SCAPEGRACE – a word that pops up every 3 or 4 years and always catches me out. I saw SCAPE quite early from wordplay but struggled to remember the rest of the word until I considered RACE as a possible event.

    My first throught on seeing Arkwright was neither Noah nor the inventor, but Ronnie Barker’s stuttering shopkeeper in Open All Hours – not that I ever saw it other than occasional endings when waiting for the next programme to come on. However the wordplay got me to SHEM who I recognised as one of Noah’s sons along with Ham and the one I can never remember, Japheth, who is not so useful to setters.

    This may have been on the easy side but I thought it was inventive at times and always entertaining.

12. 15:43 with LOI SCAPEGRACE. I know bestride but bestridden was new to me.
    Thanks setter and blogger

13. About 11′ but with a brain-freeze on SHEM. This was particularly bad as I once played his wife Sella in a school play. On research I now find that she / they had many names, none of them biblical.

    Thanks vinyl and setter.

14. 12.01, a bit sluggish throughout and held up by the long ones. I too thought of Open All Hours first (as I’m sure was intended), though I’ve never seen it.

    Thanks both.

15. Why, man, he doth bestride the narrow world
    Like a Colossus
    (Julius Caesar, Act 1, Scene 2)

    20 mins pre-brekker left me with not-Scapegoat to finish off and I struggled and gave up. Even having thought of Cape I didn’t twig that that was the S Africa bit of the clue.
    Ta setter and V

16. 24 minutes despite setting off like a bat out of hell. I was slowed down by MEGALOMANIAC, BESTRIDDEN (that horse is best ridden by 16 September 2024) and then finally by SCAPEGRACE. COD has to go to SHILLYSHALLY. Enjoyable . Thank you V and setter.

17. 47:43. Quite slow but perhaps that’s down to a poor night’s sleep. NHO SCAPEGRACE, but got there in the end. Loved SHILLYSHALLY, but it took me ages to see. Some very clever cluing I thought. Thanks both!

18. 22.01 though got distinctly derailed with scapegrace and was about to give up when I finally caught on. That episode cost me about five minutes. Lots of interesting clues – shillyshally was somehow remembered and pondered a bit over nitre wondering about what the r had to do with it. DNK nr e was the appropriate abbreviation.

    Thought the reference to Arkwright was very droll.

    But a good start to the week . Thanks setter and vinyll.

19. Another who fell at the NHO SCAPEGRACE. Kicked myself when I saw it here. Otherwise I was quite quick but held up a bit by some of the tricky long clues.

    I liked SHILLYSHALLY, which I did on the way! (Or dillydally even!)

    Thanks v and setter.

20. 6:55. One of my fastest times, although I made a mess of 12A by trying INTRUMENTALIST at first. I confess I biffed a couple from definition and checkers (MEGALOMANIAC and BESTRIDDEN) and only parsed later. I remembered SCAPEGRACE, my LOI, from another puzzle. Thanks Vinyl and setter.

21. 8:39. I started slowly on this, but then picked up speed as I went. I thought it a curious mixture of the chestnutty (TWIG, OSIER, ADZE) and the nicely witty (SHILLYSHALLY, Arkwright).

22. 20.17. No dramas, but it will probably be a long time before I use ‘bestridden’ in everyday conversation. I’ve seen the Arkwright device before, so I was ready for it. Unlike other commenters, I not only knew of, but watched ‘Open All Hours’ regularly and with great enjoyment, and also ‘Still Open All Hours’: the late Ronnie Barker was pure comedy genius, and David Jason is up there with him.

23. About 20 minutes.

    – SCAPEGRACE was the only unknown where I needed the wordplay, though I’m so used to having to separate “S African” (or “S American”) that I hesitated over it for a while
    – ‘Bent’ for ‘faculty’ isn’t the most obvious equivalence for INCUMBENT
    – Entered NITRE with a shrug before I realised the separation needed for the parsing
    – I think the surface for 22a would have worked even better with ‘for’ rather than ‘identifying’

    A nice way to start the week. Thanks vinyl and setter.

    FOI Wear
    LOI Scapegrace
    COD Culminate

24. Nerdy Shakespeare question: the expression ‘bestride the world like a Colossus’ is known from Julius Caesar, but as Kevin points out above Shakespeare used the concept in Henry IV Pt. 1, which was written a few years earlier. It was commonly (and erroneously) believed that the Colossus of Rhodes ‘bestrode’ (ie had one foot on either side of) the harbour entrance, so that’s obviously where the general concept comes from. But the very specific association of the words ‘bestride’ and ‘Colossus’ is noteworthy, and from the context it seems likely that Shakespeare got it from somewhere else. I can’t find any discussion of this online, does anyone know anything about it?

    1. I don’t know about the specific word association. I had always assumed the bard was just basing his idea on contemporary or earlier illustrations of the statue bestriding the harbour entrance (which as you say would not have been possible).

       1. Yes I’m sure that’s where the idea comes from. But from the exchange between Falstaff and Hal it’s clear that the specific association between the words ‘bestride’ and ‘Colossus’ already existed to the point that the audience would have recognised it.

          1. Absolutely – I think here the whole reason for using ‘bestride’ is to set up the joke about Falstaff’s girth.

             1. Exactly – it’s a fat joke! ‘Bestride me’ is a strange way to ask someone to come to your defence in battle so it must as you say be the set-up for the ‘Colossus’ pay-off.

25. Quick today, no problems and no nhos, though “bestridden” scarcely in daily use hereabouts. Nor Italicisms, come to that.

26. A comfortable 12.40, though it took me a while to unpack how BESTRIDDEN worked, even though all three elements were standard. I’m surprised to find SCAPEGRACE doesn’t go anywhere near as far back as the master neologist Shakespeare – it’s mid 19th century. Other mild surprises: EMMENTHAL still with an H (not in Tesco’s!) and CLARINETTIST with an extra T.
    I rather liked ENGLISHMAN clued with Irish and Scottish names: there’s a joke in there somewhere. And for Merlin’s benefit (to whom much thanks) I don’t pronounce NIAMH “correctly”. Even Irish spelling can’t push those letters that far.

    1. But Thesco’s would be silly..

       1. 🤭 Yeth it thertainly would!

27. DNF

    I managed to invent MEGALOMANIAN. I guess it looks faintly plausible as an adjective. Beyond that I just sort of spotted OMANI then take your pick from IAN or MEGAN (which I think I had confused in my mind with MORAG).

    1. Me too. Joined the OWL club today because of it.

       1. I struggled for or a while because the answer had to be an adjective, not a noun: it eventually occurred to me that megalomaniac is both noun and adjective. D’oh!

28. 18.57 DNF

    Unlike others I struggled with this, particularly the long ones, not knowing SCAPEGRACE and with SHILLYSHALLY holding out for ages as did ____RIDDEN (wanting overridden). In the end turns out I had bashed in ITALICISED without seeing the momble impact on EMMENTHAL

    Liked it though

29. 12:00 – an easy start to the week, once those pesky double letters were sorted out. Ashamed to admit I didn’t twig the Noah connection before coming here. Fortunately I didn’t have to.

30. 20 mins.
    I first encountered the word ‘scapegrace’ in the Kingsley Amis novel ‘The Folks That Live on the Hill’, a rather bleak late-period urban comedy peopled by feckless, posh Londoners who drink too much and don’t have to work for a living. Amis’s late novels are all a bit like this: the peerless comedy set-pieces of the earlier novels are still there, but the characters have become hollow and bitter.
    Thanks, v.

    1. As he did?
       Apropos Kingsley Amis, somewhere in The Times recently I read that when he was knighted, he was so terrified of farting in front of the queen that he took a massive dose of immodium, beforehand. His son Martin said “There was some doubt about whether he would ever visit the lavatory again.”

    2. Have you ever tried his son’s stuff? I’ve come to it late and am enjoying the ride.

       1. Martin was magnificent. Apart from the earlier novels, The Rub of Time, a latter-day compendium including a lot of magazine journalism, and the ‘novel’ Inside Story are essential reading, just brilliant. And how good is Lionel Asbo? As Ulaca said, it’s a ride and a great one.

31. Very enjoyable 25′. Like others raced off from the start in QC style, then took some time to solve some of the remaining clever and entertaining wordplay. Once I’d manufactured POI SHEM (only then did the penny drop) I then built out the NHO SCAPEGRACE. But lots of nice clues, SHILLYSHALLY especially. Thanks Vinyl and setter

32. I was out of the blocks very quickly, but then ground to a rapid halt. Then after sorting out most of the rest I was left with just the four pesky dodecasyllables, none of which suggested an obvious answer. Then the penny dropped with SHILLYSHALLY, and I crossed the line in 29 minutes. Overall, an enjoyable exercise.
    FOI – TOWNSWOMEN
    LOI – BESTRIDDEN
    COD – SHILLYSHALLY
    Thanks to vinyl and other contributors.

33. 19:22
    Sailed through half of this and then slowed down dramatically. Lots to like. Needed vinyl to explain NITRE.

    BESTRIDDEN. SHILLY SHALLY, INCUMBENT, SCAPEGRACE all good words, worthy of an airing . I think an ADZE like an etui is rarely seen outside Cruciverbia.

    Thanks to vinyl and the setter.

34. I must be becoming feeble in my old age because although everyone seems to be saying how easy this was I didn’t think so and a few times got stuck: I thought the South African event was some word I didn’t know from their equivalent of the highland games; Arkwright was bewildering for a long time; Scot = Mac was pretty obvious but didn’t occur for ages — I was looking for someone from some region of Scotland, like an Aberdonian; and several others, which were easy enough in retrospect, caused delays, so that eventually I took 63 minutes.

35. 16 mins. Held up by SHILLY-SHALLY (note that it’s hyphenated in spell check) because I thought it must be SCILLI……. I’d even vaguely heard of SCAPEGRACE.

36. Raced through most of this but got held up at the end by the parsing of NITRE and then SCAPEGRACE and LOI, BESTRIDDEN. Fortunately a proof read revealed CLARINETISST, before submission. 20:15. Thanks setter and Vinyl.

37. Revealed SCAPEGRACE (nho) and LOI BESTRIDDEN (would not have seen deliver = rid). Otherwise all fairly straightforward. CLARINETTIST looked odd but I note the comments above. Lots to like for someone still making the jump from the QC. Many thanks all.

38. Not as easy as one has come to expect on a Monday, and I biffed half a dozen, all of which I quickly parsed after submission.

    FOI TOWNSWOMEN
    LOI NITRE
    COD LOCKSMITH
    TIME 6:29

39. After a very fast start I got a bit bogged down in the end, but eventually crossed the line in 34.17. I got the gist of the clue for 26ac, but decided one of Noah’s sons was called SETH, and although it didn’t parse I thought I must be missing something. When finally SCAPEGRACE was worked out, SHEM my LOI followed soon after.

40. Under 10 for the first time in a while.

    SHILLYSHALLY was holding me up at the end, and had started inserting letters between the first S and I – luckily H comes early on, and the penny dropped quickly. That gets COD.

    9:56

41. OWL club for me today- MEGALOMANIAN anyone? I was focused on IAN as a Scot’s name I suppose.
    BESTRIDDEN last in. Hadn’t thought of Deliver being Rid before.
    Enjoyable blog and puzzle

42. To my shame i always struggle when the female version is used as in 1ac. Twrnty mins is slow for me on Mondays. Not sure why.

43. At home waiting for someone, so I had time for this.
    And I didn’t need much (in my terms);only held up a bit to get BESTRIDDEN from the cryptic.
    COD to SHILLYSHALLY.
    Fun.
    David

44. For me, that was a game of two halves. The top half was easy, pretty much Quick Cryptic level, and nearly all of it went straight in, but I had some trouble with the bottom half. BESTRIDDEN is not part of my active vocabulary and if I had to give a synonym for it, “dominated” would not be it, but I had all the checkers and could see how it parsed, so in it went.

    LOI was SCAPEGRACE – I had all the checkers and obviously I had heard of the word or it wouldn’t have come into my head, but I had no idea what it meant, so the definition “mischief-maker” didn’t help me at all; but, as with BESTRIDDEN, once it had occurred to me as possibly the answer, I could see how it parsed.

    I’m not sure how long it took to finish – not very long at all to do the top half but I took a break for a while because I was getting nowhere with a lot of the bottom half and needed to clear my head of what I was sure were several wrong lines of thought. That often works for me and, sure enough, when I went back to it, it didn’t take too long to unravel the remainder.

45. 23:30

    I did wonder as I crossed the 20-minute mark whether I could finish this. With five answers unanswered, none looked particularly easy. So it was with some surprise that spotting SHILLYSHALLY should see the remaining answers fall like a house of cards. LOCKSMITH, the NHO SCAPEGRACE, BESTRIDDEN and finally NITRE wrote themselves in, in quick succession, around the pencilled INCUMBENT – hadn’t been sure why that would apply to parsons specifically. So, all in all, not too bad after all, though I would certainly not have said it was an easy Monday…

    Thanks V and setter

46. 23:45
    I have played the clarinet on and off for over fifty years, but still hesitated over the double T in CLARINTTIST.
    No problem with INCUMBENT. Our church has a “list of incumbents” listing vicars from the 13th century to the present day.
    LOI was BESTRIDDEN, built up in parts, with a pause to convince myself it was a real word.

    Thanks vinyl and setter

47. Finished with fingers crossed for bestridden (phew) and scopagrace (drat, DNF after all).

48. 20 minutes – good fun – COD to Shillyshally (which my spell checker prompts as Shilly-shally).

49. Felt I was heading for a rare under-tenner, so biffed like crazy and yes! came in at 9’16”. Not quite a personal best but not far off. Silly setting oneself these competitive targets, but I enjoy it. Many thanks. Now for Friday’s. Snitch double today’s.

50. Finished with a pink square after 32 minutes. I spent the last seven getting the NHO SCAPEGRACE, only to discover I’d misspelled ADSE for the umpteenth time. Thanks vinyl1.

    1. Commiserations. Take it from me that the number of times you can spell ADZE wrong before it finally lodges itself correctly in your brain is, while surprisingly large, not infinite.

       1. With other words I think that’s a tricky one, but with adze I’m consistently, confidently wrong. Maybe this will cement the right spelling. If not, see you next time!

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